No crank with whining noise

[Landon730]

Looks like something added on, trailer brakes?

No some kind of weird stuff I got some pictures. Do these two purple wires hook together to get rid of that crap? This picture of purple wires ^

 

[Husker6.5]

That long wire that runs from the positive battery terminal along side the starter cable down to the starter (but does NOT attach to anything) then goes back up to that terminal block is the HOT wire from the alternator that charges your batteries! Yup! That convoluted mess is a ROYAL P.I.T.A.! When GM relocated the alternator from DS to PS, that wire became about 12" long from the back of the alternator to the PS positive battery to starter cable end.

Yes there is a fusible link in that wire, both the old style and the new. Use a VOM to check continuity/resistance of that charging wire. I suspecf that the link is open and that the P.O. jerry-rigged that jumper/switch assembly to bypass the open link, but in doing so managed to miswire it so that when it was turned 'On' to allow the alternator to charge the batteries when the engine was running, it instead back-fed voltage to the starter solenoid and engaged the starter (possibly with the motor running) and fried the starter.

I can NOT stress enough the need for you to get a genuine GM Service manual wiring diagram for that vehicle before going willy-nilly at an attempt to diagnose/repair your wiring issues.

 

[Landon730]

This is also in the mess

 

[Landon730]

That long wire that runs from the positive battery terminal along side the starter cable down to the starter (but does NOT attach to anything) then goes back up to that terminal block is the HOT wire from the alternator that charges your batteries! Yup! That convoluted mess is a ROYAL P.I.T.A.! When GM relocated the alternator from DS to PS, that wire became about 12" long from the back of the alternator to the PS positive battery to starter cable end.

Yes there is a fusible link in that wire, both the old style and the new. Use a VOM to check continuity/resistance of that charging wire. I suspecf that the link is open and that the P.O. jerry-rigged that jumper/switch assembly to bypass the open link, but in doing so managed to miswire it so that when it was turned 'On' to allow the alternator to charge the batteries when the engine was running, it instead back-fed voltage to the starter solenoid and engaged the starter (possibly with the motor running) and fried the starter.

I can NOT stress enough the need for you to get a genuine GM Service manual wiring diagram for that vehicle before going willy-nilly at an attempt to diagnose/repair your wiring issues.

I’ve got the wire your talking about run correctly from battery to that block. I still have these 2 wires that are kind of pointless right now. I fixed the burnt wires and I still have nothing. Starting to get aggravated lol

 

[Will L.]

Na, using an old extension cord in a way that it has a full thermal melt down is electrical engineering at its best!

Dude, I feel for ya. But imo you need to remove every after market piece of wire from that truck. Rip off all the looming and tape to find out what is left useable and replace all the damage. It is time consuming and annoying as heck, but that part is only labor.

You mentioned your Dad’s truck- finding out what is missing or dead leads to duplicating the original harness. Not sure if any of the truck aftermarket companies make harnesses for your rig or not. But would be worth looking into if it is really bad. Otherwise- duplicate your Dad’s truck if it is same options and era.

The factory harness and design wasn’t horrible. Just laking in a couple areas like grounding. But I don’t even mess with the factory harness for that- just run external ground loop from batteries to frame, body, engine. Pmd relocation as needed, and inline relay on the ops sensor circuit.

If you have a good multi meter- good. A power probe 3 master kit is even better- best automotive electrical tool ever invented. A punching bag is the second.

Many people get scared off by electrical nightmares. If this is a truck you dont need in a rush- it’s the best thing for you. You’ll fight through it, but when done will have the whole truck’s system corrected and you will sail through future problems on other rigs.

 

[Landon730]

Na, using an old extension cord in a way that it has a full thermal melt down is electrical engineering at its best!

Dude, I feel for ya. But imo you need to remove every after market piece of wire from that truck. Rip off all the looming and tape to find out what is left useable and replace all the damage. It is time consuming and annoying as heck, but that part is only labor.

You mentioned your Dad’s truck- finding out what is missing or dead leads to duplicating the original harness. Not sure if any of the truck aftermarket companies make harnesses for your rig or not. But would be worth looking into if it is really bad. Otherwise- duplicate your Dad’s truck if it is same options and era.

The factory harness and design wasn’t horrible. Just laking in a couple areas like grounding. But I don’t even mess with the factory harness for that- just run external ground loop from batteries to frame, body, engine. Pmd relocation as needed, and inline relay on the ops sensor circuit.

If you have a good multi meter- good. A power probe 3 master kit is even better- best automotive electrical tool ever invented. A punching bag is the second.

Many people get scared off by electrical nightmares. If this is a truck you dont need in a rush- it’s the best thing for you. You’ll fight through it, but when done will have the whole truck’s system corrected and you will sail through future problems on other rigs.

All I have is a test light, better then nothing but not a meter. Need to buy a punching bag lol but I've nearly eliminated most of the aftermarket crap. Got a couple more ideas of places to check. Going to get a different starter to just to eliminate that and then just starting chasing every wire.

 

[Will L.]

Before getting another starter, especially if tight on money, pull it and bench test it.
Repair as much of the wiring as you can before putting in any new parts. Electrical system being jacked up could damage new parts.

 

[WarWagon]

This is a simple wireing system. A bit more info at where the burnt wires go would help.

First off you have a high current big wire going to the starter from the battery. Then you are supposed to have a small wire goint to the starter to turn it on. This small wire comes from the ignition switch. The ignition switch gets power through the cab connector driver side firewall and continue to the positive power bus on the passinger side you have a pic of. Many fusible links on it and one burned off rather than burn truck to the ground. I could be off and power comes in on the passinger side firewall pass through, but that powers the cig lighter and blower motor...

The diagram above will help if you follow the starter wires.

IMO something like the starter stuck on and melted the ignition power fusible link. Then dumbass of the day attempted to start the truck with directaly powering the starter solonoid and here is the important part: didn't bother to provide 12v to the injection pump. Never going to start.

So repair the burnt wires. Then correctly wire the starter back into the harness.

 

[WarWagon]

Wrote the above missing a page. Stupidphone... That Motorola is a radio. It can be removed. The relay is not stock so it can be gone.

A test light will work. Is it the kind that lights up on 12v from the battery? If so: I would work on getting 12v to the fuse block in the cab. You need to pull and inspect every fuse one at a time.

The passinger side battery provides power to the bus on the passinger side firewall. It shorts out on the battery tray and GM stupidly ran it by the starter where the manifold heat melts insulation off and another short. I run a replacement under the air filter from battery to bus bar on passinger firewall.

 

[Landon730]

Wrote the above missing a page. Stupidphone... That Motorola is a radio. It can be removed. The relay is not stock so it can be gone.

A test light will work. Is it the kind that lights up on 12v from the battery? If so: I would work on getting 12v to the fuse block in the cab. You need to pull and inspect every fuse one at a time.

The passenger side battery provides power to the bus on the passenger side firewall. It shorts out on the battery tray and GM stupidly ran it by the starter where the manifold heat melts insulation off and another short. I run a replacement under the air filter from battery to bus bar on passenger firewall.

Ok, tomorrow I will go over everything you gave me and let you know what I've got. Going to wire starter back factory. I have the wire run from the pas. battery to that bus and have good power there. (Yes my test light is 12v) Where the burnt wires were with that relay, I took that out and hooked that purple wire back together. I have no juice to the fuse block though, although when I press rcl on radio it displays time, but when I hit power it wont turn on. If back doors are opened, the roof light comes on. Also if you press buttons on roof light it will turn on. Gonna do a WHOOOOLE bunch of back-to-factory wiring tomorrow lol. I'll let you know what I've got in the morning.

 

[Jaryd]

The black Motorola thing is from a OLD cell phone that was probably mounted in the floor I bet. My mama had one in her Jeep and it looked real close to that when I took it out for them.

 

[Husker6.5]

Is that a new starter cable assembly, or the original one? If original, did you check for continuity/resistance of the the lead to the terminal block (while disconnected from block) back to the battery cable end? There's a fusible link in there because that is the charging wire from the alternator output.

 

[Landon730]

I found the problem. Half of it anyways. I found a burnt wire off the bus and I fixed it with a in line fuse. Now the problem is the starter won't spin and whenever I turn the key to the start position it pops the fuse. I went all the way up to a 30 amp fuse and it still blows. Does this wire not need a fuse is the reason I keep blowing it? (From to high amperage?)

 

[ak diesel driver]

sounds like a another short in the wiring. starter wire should have minimal amperage going thru it as the selenoid on the starter carries the main amperage

 

[Landon730]

sounds like a another short in the wiring. starter wire should have minimal amperage going thru it as the selenoid on the starter carries the main amperage

Once I fixed the burnt wire I have power to the fuse block and dash but the starter still doesn't engage and it pops the fuse I added. Any ideas? Do I need to keep going through the harness?

 

[ak diesel driver]

yes. that white thing in the picture on the wire is a fusible link I believe

 

[Landon730]

yes. that white thing in the picture on the wire is a fusible link I believe

I had to cut it out to splice new wire in, thats why I added that fuse there

 

[Will L.]

A fuse CAN’T take the place of a fuseable link wire.

Ensure the starter works proper before replacing the fuseable link.

 

[Landon730]

A fuse CAN’T take the place of a fuseable link wire.

Ensure the starter works proper before replacing the fuseable link.

Do I need to take the fuse part of and just splice the wire back together? Can I go buy a new fusable link?

 

[Will L.]

They sell fuseable link at auto parts stores. You just use crimp connections for it.

But something is causing an issue. Installing new link now is waste of money. You have to find the short or test the starter draw. Sounds like you don’t have an inductive amp meter, so unfortunately you need to drop the starter and take it in to autoparts store for bench testing.

Cut out and bring the bad fuseable link with you to match up amperage needed while there getting it tested.

I used to go to public library and get manuals for rigs. Might check out that option. Nowdays they probably have it all free on the computers and librarians that can help with online searching