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DIY BD1 Programming - Burn your own chips!

So just out of curiosity for those of us who happen to own both OBD-I and OBD-II vehicles, will there be tunes developed for the OBD-II's and how hard to reflash those onto an ECM vs. a chip for OBD-I?
 
BoostN said:
We have a tune library here if you want to share to "Registered Members". Let me know the file format and I'll be sure to make a category if you wish to upload files here.
Click to expand...

Wow, that library is perfect. What we're using are 64k files with a .bin extension. If we could get a sub category for obdi under 6.5, we would be in business. Thanks!
 
Husker6.5 said:
So just out of curiosity for those of us who happen to own both OBD-I and OBD-II vehicles, will there be tunes developed for the OBD-II's and how hard to reflash those onto an ECM vs. a chip for OBD-I?
Click to expand...

There already are "tunes" developed for OBDII, they're just not readily found on the net like OBDI stuff.

In actual practice, it's easier to "flash" and obdII PCM (16216588) that it is to deal with an OBDI, once you have the hardware/software that is.

For example:

OBDI - remove PCM from dash, open PCM, remove MEMCAL, modify memcal to remove PROM and use a (IIRC) 27SF512 EEPROM (or you need an IR eraser for the IR chips), use a ZIF if you plan to install/remove a lot, flash your blank chip with a Wilem programmer (or something similar), reinstall MEMCAL, reinstall PCM, go for a drive. Repeat as necessary.

Once you've got the MEMCAL modified, you can drop those steps. You still have to remove the PCM to change the chip, unless you want and adpater cable hanging out of you dash. I've spent many a trip down the road with no glove box installed and ribbon cables hanging out of a 7747 ECM....never again....

OBDII - hook up to the ALDL port with the adapter and upload the new calibration right to the truck. Done.

I've left out the reworking of the program in the list because that's the same amount of work for each.

The major hurdle to OBDII is you have to have a fairly significant outlay of cash to "get in".

Where OBDI can be cobbled together with ebay parts and some freeware, OBDII stuff is much more locked down by the developers. So ya gotta pay.

Still no worse than EFILive at around 800 bucks. If you do your research, you can get in right around that price.

Thing is, 6.X-ers are a ....how shall I say it....."frugal"....bunch.

Now, OBDI...that's more affordable. You can be up and running in a very basic capacity for a couple hundred bucks. OBDI has been hacked and ripped 7 different ways to Sunday, which is why it's cheap to get in to.

Tuner pro is freeware.

Definition files are easily scabbed off other templates.

Hardware for everything from adapters to emulators to switching adapters are available from various sources.

Dig around a moates<dot>net and you can find all the things you need affordably, put enough thought into it and you'll see some stuff that is sold much more expensively elsewhere).

Heck, dig around on eBay and you get get enough of it together to at least start up.

I may be a little bit off on the OBDI hardware, it's been several years since I've dabbled in it.

Once I converted my 1989 K1500 ECLB from an OBDI 7427 pcm to an OBDII 411 PCM, I never looked back....OBDII is just so much more civil to work with.

At least, IMHO it is.

Just trying to pass on info for questions being asked, not trying to start anything........no harm no foul.
 
After having put together all of the items needed for an OBDI programming setup, I could duplicate what I have for about $60. Using an even cheaper ebay burner (no win7 support, must have an XP machine), I could do it for $50.

This is assuming you already have a computer of some type (aren't you on the internet right now?!), a soldering iron, solder, and the knowledge needed to use those last 2.
 
So Great White, if one were to get a good tune for OBD-II for a 6.5, say a great economy tune, could a person download the file and store it on a USB thumb drive or SDHC card and then say take it to their mechanic who happens to have a full GM Tech 2 scanner and have them upload the flash to the Tech 2 and then reflash the ECM? Because that's essentially how he updated the GM tune on my Burb, he downloaded it from GM, then used his Tech 2 to reflash my ECM. $75/hour for his labor to do that is a whole lot cheaper than the $800 cash outlay you're talking about to purchase the hardware (I'm assuming you are referring to a Tech 2) to do it yourself.
 
Just thinking as well, that if someone wanted to become a vendor, they could sell selected burns from the library for 25 bucks or so to help out those who don't have the equipment, or who just don't want to go through the learning curve. I've always contended that people own 6.5's because they are frugal, and chip prices are out of reach for most.
 
Husker6.5 said:
So Great White, if one were to get a good tune for OBD-II for a 6.5, say a great economy tune, could a person download the file and store it on a USB thumb drive or SDHC card and then say take it to their mechanic who happens to have a full GM Tech 2 scanner and have them upload the flash to the Tech 2 and then reflash the ECM? Because that's essentially how he updated the GM tune on my Burb, he downloaded it from GM, then used his Tech 2 to reflash my ECM. $75/hour for his labor to do that is a whole lot cheaper than the $800 cash outlay you're talking about to purchase the hardware (I'm assuming you are referring to a Tech 2) to do it yourself.
Click to expand...

First problem with this that I found is that I know of no software that allows you to read an ECM from a 6.5. The data files out there for sale are just that, the actual tune data files. The people that hacked teh OBD2 stuff did it this way so that peopel couldn't buy 1 ECM and then copy and load it to everybody elses stuff. Now if you built your own tune file you could distribute it however you wanted to. Secondly, you have to use teh hardware AND software teh tune file was designed to use. You cannot just take a tunerpro file and flash it in with a tech 2 as the file types are not compatible. The TECH 2 now will only download it's file directly from GM via the TIS 2 website. I believe great white is using a MOATES flash tool, and a later version of tunercat II for the actual software flashing(not sure as it has been a long time since I looked into doing OBD2 6.5 flashing). And EFILIVE has now went up to $899 for a V2 and the GM tuning($499 for the V2 flashing tool, $400 for the GM tuning, and another $400 if you want the CUMMINS tuning). OBD2 isn't a cheap game to get into like the OBD1 stuff is, hence why you go on EBAY and see so many people still selling OBD1 chips for things.
 
I would have no problem building adapters and burning chips for a little money. What does it taketo become a vendor?
 
If the library had a great selection of programs, then the buyer could select their program, and a vendor could burn the chip and drop it in the mail. Little out of pocket expense and a whole new world opened up to everyone.
 
Here's another caveat. Smartphone scanner. Basically scantech app. Someone could make some great cash. I bet every member on here and other places would pay ten bucks for that app, and repay each time they upgraded their smartphones.
 
One last idea and I'll shut up. I'll bet a guy like racedaymechanic could develop a really slick under hood conversion harness for obd2 to obd1. I know some people would be interested in going backwards in technology just to be able to use gmtdscantch tdc learn on obd2. Then a dirt cheap tune would sweeten the deal. Dunno if it's feasible, but as I own both obd1 and obd2, it has been on my mind. Also, seeing the obd2 guys pleading for help makes it seem as if there's a need.
 
oldblacksmoker said:
One last idea and I'll shut up. I'll bet a guy like racedaymechanic could develop a really slick under hood conversion harness for obd2 to obd1. I know some people would be interested in going backwards in technology just to be able to use gmtdscantch tdc learn on obd2. Then a dirt cheap tune would sweeten the deal. Dunno if it's feasible, but as I own both obd1 and obd2, it has been on my mind. Also, seeing the obd2 guys pleading for help makes it seem as if there's a need.
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I don't think it would be that hard to make a OBD2 to OBD1 conversion as the newer OBD2 ECM's are physisacally identical to the OBD1 ECm except they don't have a cover to access the EEPROM. The problem would come into play that the OBD2 architecture in the truck would no longer function properly. OBD1 used stand alone for everything, and nothing talked to each other. In OBD2 everything was linked via the J1850 data bus for the OBD2 plug and all could talk over the class 2 data bus. They're completely different architectures and electrical engineering. That is how my DURAMAX swap was made so simple was my BURB was already stand-alone, so swapping in a different engine worked great with no funny lights because everything already worked on it's own. It would be nice if somebody could come up with a software hack to use one of teh cheap aftermarket ALDL cables for OBD2, and make it work with the older tunercat freeware. It wouldn't be a top of teh line interface, but could get the job done. But it WOULD take somebody with a knowledge of computers and data protocols to pull it off.
 
Here's my question ... something I've not been sure about:

How does this affect 5068 IP's vs 5521 IP's? I have a 5068 IP in my rig and a 5521 IP on my bench that I'd like to put in.

What is the difference between the programs for these two IP's?

I just saw the Library forum. Looks pretty badass if you ask me.

As for vendor status, do we really need it for this? Once I get my programmer (I already have access to one) I'd be more than happy to just burn a chip for someone. Just send me the chip and tell me which BIN to burn and I'd do it and ship it back, no cost.
 
The 5521 and 5068 use 2 differen cam and plunger arrangements. The 5068 outputs slightly more fuel, but it does it in a quite a bit different way than the 5521 does. To swap pumps you have to swap to the correct programming to match the cam and plunger arrangement in order for it to regulate the fuel delivery correctly.
 
@ Orionthade, I'd be willing to do the same. I just think that a friendly twenty would definitely motivate someone to make it happen fast. Also, if several of us had a supply of chips, we could just volunteer to ship them to the address without the complicated correspondence.
Regarding the 5521 pump, I changed mine from a 5068 and just put a '95 chip in it. I do believe that a 94 has an extra baro reading or something like that, but as far as I can tell, it's not a problem. Buddy could probably give a lot more accurate answer.
 
OrionThade said:
Here's my question ... something I've not been sure about:

How does this affect 5068 IP's vs 5521 IP's? I have a 5068 IP in my rig and a 5521 IP on my bench that I'd like to put in.

What is the difference between the programs for these two IP's?

I just saw the Library forum. Looks pretty badass if you ask me.

As for vendor status, do we really need it for this? Once I get my programmer (I already have access to one) I'd be more than happy to just burn a chip for someone. Just send me the chip and tell me which BIN to burn and I'd do it and ship it back, no cost.
Click to expand...

When money is exchanged a vendor status is needed, it's not only fair to the others that pay, but we have bills to pay also. If anyone thinks these sites are cheap then no, they are not.

And look at our vendor prices, for a tuner only vendor. http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/vendor.pdf

$225 for all year. If you actually sold a good quality product, then nothing would stop a vendor from paying that back in a few short sales.

It's much easier becoming a vendor and supporting the site with a great product and being able to OPENLY advertise, we've had others that choose not to pay and try to be a vendor with insertions in to posts about their products and how special it is against someone elses (paying vendors), it doesn't fly around here. We ask for members to pay up or privileges are taken away.
 
BoostN said:
When money is exchanged a vendor status is needed, it's not only fair to the others that pay, but we have bills to pay also. If anyone thinks these sites are cheap then no, they are not.

And look at our vendor prices, for a tuner only vendor. http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/vendor.pdf

$225 for all year. If you actually sold a good quality product, then nothing would stop a vendor from paying that back in a few short sales.

It's much easier becoming a vendor and supporting the site with a great product and being able to OPENLY advertise, we've had others that choose not to pay and try to be a vendor with insertions in to posts about their products and how special it is against someone elses (paying vendors), it doesn't fly around here. We ask for members to pay up or privileges are taken away.
Click to expand...

Which is why I said "I would just burn a chip for someone". No money exchanges hands.
 
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