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6.5L TD Motorhome repair/repower

3bals

3bals

Retired Firefighter
Messages
428
Reaction score
297
Location
Minnesota
Well here we go. It's been almost a year 6/17/13, that my motorhome let me done and I broke my leg 2/23/13. Now, my leg has healed and I'm finally getting to the motorhome repair.

Here's the thread, for those that don't know or don't remember:

http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/showthread.php?39439-New-injectors/page5


I've made up my mind on just how I want to do it. First, I found a local diesel shop that knows 6.5s and I'll be having him repair the issue under the pass side valve cover. Also I'll have him try to find the electrical issue we were having too.

Then the plan is to drive it out to Grand Rapids MI to Peninsular and have Matt install a brand new P400 with a rear mounted turbo and intercooler. I had a conversation with Matt the other day and am waiting for more details (cost and such). The repower should take 4-5 days. When I get it home, I'll have new tires, brakes and shocks put on. That should set it up to be good for many miles of traveling.

I know it's going to cost some $$$$, but it's no good the way it is and given what I paid for the unit originally, it'll still be an OK deal. I think the P400 will be a much better engine to rely on for the motorhome use, than the 18:1 I have in my garage that I bought for my K2500. That way I can still use it for that purpose. I figure I'll just slip over to the neighbor's back yard some night and dig up some jars of money. :D

Here's a picture of the sliced valve cover. I'll post more pix when I get them and keep the info coming.
 

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I am going to guess one of your retainers let go. They get super brittle if you over heat the motor. I am going to guess the PO over heated the motor and set the motion of the dominoes into effect.

I just replaced my retainers. Only one was bad and it probably would have still held in place for another couple thousand miles or more. The rest probably would have lasted another 100,000 miles.

My brother got his truck with issues. The PO over heated the motor. He had over 6 retainers that were completely broken. One was no longer in its original hole. The rest were severely cracked or extremely brittle.

Wish you luck on getting the 6.5TD back up and running. Glad to hear your leg is all healed up. :hello:
 
Well, The process has started. It was towed to a local shop on Monday. They're supposed to start on it today. I told them to fix the electrical issues first, so that it starts and runs before they tear into the valve issue. That's just incase there are major issues, like a dropped valve or something equally as catastrophic. If that's the case then I'll have to go to plan "B" or "C".

Otherwise all is set out at Peninsular for the repower next month.
 
3bals said:
I told them to fix the electrical issues first, so that it starts and runs before they tear into the valve issue. That's just incase there are major issues, like a dropped valve or something equally as catastrophic. If that's the case then I'll have to go to plan "B" or "C".
Click to expand...

If the motor is not healthy enough for driving to Peninsular, does Plan B, C, D, E . . . Z look something like this?

08.jpg
 
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Why not just ship (tow) the thing to Peninsular? How many miles is it and did you get some shipping estimates? May help with cost decisions to patch the old engine.

After your saga X2 and planing on dropping a complete engine on it... I would go DB2 mechanical injection. No electrical PMD - just the 'engine on' coil wire and the cold advance is 'optional' to get/stay running. Stand alone trans controller. Twin Walbro FRB-5 lift pumps in parallel.

I still own my 1993 and the big reason is after it starts it stays running - lift pump optional. The DS4 I would have to tow without a lift pump. The kinked fuel line didn't help it's reputation regardless of fault. Sure IMO the PMD munching DS4 starts easier and is more refined all the way around - when it runs and isn't fishbiting.

Did you pull and look at the failed glow plugs? I understand that glow plug erosion is from too much timing advance. So you may look at them for this possibility. What kind of glow plugs did you have burn out?

Your misfire went away after the injector change? If so this cured a problem. It may have left another problem. That or your are really lucky to have the rocker parts wander back into place and stay there for the number of miles. Did you even check the fuel filter for the last ditch screen? I assume you have the round can like the pickups have.

Guessing the rocker may have wandered around in the engine awhile. It should have unusual wear marks if it did.

I just can't see a stuck valve or object jamming the valve forcing the rocker out of place - it would bend the pushrod.

Maybe the rocker hold down bolts came loose?
 
Jay, although funny and I would love to transport it that way if I had the time and resources, a conventional tow would have been the way.

WW, to answer some of your questions.

1. As far as the tow/shipping to Peninsular, I was looking into that option, if there was going to be more to the repair of the valve train than just a rocker assembly and to weld up the valve cover. It’s 458 miles from my place to theirs.
2. As far as switching to a db2 set-up, I’m not sure I want to add that cost into the situation. (throttle cables, stand alone trans controller, etc, etc) That may be fine for a burb or pickup, but not something I’d like to tackle for this motorhome.
3. I did change the GPs to duratherms right before the trip, so that probably wasn’t the issue.
4. It seemed to run fine after the injector was replaced, again right before the trip (for awhile).
As far as what really happened under the valve cover, that’s to be determined yet. As far as what can be seen through the slit, is the rocker flopping around.

Now I’ll explain what the events that were up to the no start in Lincoln, NE on 6/17/13.

Prior to leaving home on this trip from hell, I changed oil/filter, GPs, one injector (#8), plus did all the other normal pre trip vehicle preparations.

We took off that evening and noticed that the vehicle AC wasn’t working. I thought, no problem, I’ll just start the generator and run the roof air. We then made it 40 miles before I realized that I forgot our back country permit for the Grand Canyon. So, we turned around and went back to get it. While back, I figured we better top off the LP for the generator and as long as we’re at it, we’ll top off the fuel too. As we headed back down the road, I was noticing some fishbite. Just a little at first, but the further we got the worse it got. I was thinking I took on some bad fuel, as I don’t usually buy fuel from that place. It was just convenient because of the LP fill-up. We pulled into a Walmart later that evening west of Omaha for the evening and it was running poorly at that time. We filled up with fresh fuel in the morning thinking that may cure the issue, but it really didn’t. A few miles down the road, I was having issues with the rear view camera and the dashboard gauges were malfunctioning. We pulled into a truckstop about 20 miles east of Lincoln, NE to investigate. I couldn’t move the electric seats back to remove the doghouse cover. I checked the fuses to find one burned out and when I replaced it, the seats worked. I also removed the dashboard and radio to see if something went wrong behind there. I put a new radio in the year before. Nothing obvious with the wiring and once I got the doghouse cover off, I saw the gash in the ps valve cover. At that time we decided to shift gears and make alternate plans to continue to the Grand Canyon via our tow car. We were able to get a campsite 20 miles away in Lincoln and drove there. We stopped at the office to register and when we went to drive to the campsite, there was a no start. Turned over, but just wouldn’t fire. That’s when I called Husker65 to help out. Then the rest has been told in previous threads.

About a week ago, I did try a different PMD/heatsink/ext cable, just to see if that may be the issue. It wasn’t. So, the tow was ordered to the local diesel shop last Monday. They promised me that they would start on it Tuesday. Well, Thursday afternoon it was still sitting outside where it was dropped off. On Friday all kinds of things changed. Good, bad and otherwise. I got a call first thing in the morning from the shop that they turned the key and it started right up. To me, while being a good thing, it was really bad, as how do you fix something the works? They were going to try a few things to try to duplicate the non-run issue. Meanwhile I went about my day until I got an email from Matt at Peninsular. He said that their tech that does the P400 repower work for them no longer works there and they don’t have a replacement, so they can’t do the project for me. It even sounds doubtful that I can even get a P400 from them. I’ll have to wait until Monday when my email gets answered.

Meanwhile, I had to hurry over to the diesel shop to make sure they do not tear into the valve cover, yet. When I got there, they had some good news. They discovered the wire harness that connects the PMD extension cable to the IP was bad. Also when the tech was underneath hooking up the driveshaft, he noticed a small hole in the exhaust that was pointed right at a bundle of wires and had burned most of the insulation off them. That may have been some of my electrical issues. I have not seen it yet, so I don’t know what those wires go to.

After I left the diesel shop, I went to the local bus/motor coach/RV place. The have been around for years and build, refurbish and repair busses/motor coaches/motorhomes, including custom tour busses for different venues. Even though it was Friday afternoon, I was able to talk to their motorhome repair person. He was knowledgeable about P30 chassis and 6.5 L TDs. I will be driving my rig over there Monday morning (it’s only about a mile from where it’s parked now) to have them look at it and to discuss the things that I would like done and what parts I can provide.

So, it’s been a rollercoaster of emotions this week regarding my motorhome and the repower project, but at least we kind of know what the electrical issues are and I’m still in the running for a new engine. It just might not be the P400 I wanted. We’ll just have to wait until Monday/Tuesday to find out more details. We are still in the time frame to salvage some of the summer travels yet.
 
This is what I was planning on getting from Matt:

One new P-400 with the low back-pressure Borg Warner turbo.

Heavy duty pistons 18 to 1.

Harmonic balancer.
Automatic flywheel
Intake manifold.
RH and LH stainless headers, riser with joint and heat expansion sections
Turbo mounting
Air intake adapter
 
The stainless headers were something that Peninsular was going to fabricate to fit my motorhome. It was going to put the turbo behind the engine, above the transmission.

Here's a photo of the exhaust leak that took out some wires. I'm not sure where exactly it is under there, as I didn't take the pic and haven't crawled under there to look yet. My biggest project is to figure out and get the engine/turbo I want. I'm still waiting to hear from Peninsular.
 

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Well good news, at this time. It looks like Peninsular can provide the P400 with 18:1 pistons, turbo and the custom headers/turbo connections.

If all goes according to plan, they will ship it to the local bus/motorcoach/RV shop that will do the install. I talked to them yesterday and they can get started in 3-4 weeks. I'm trying to arrange all the parts and pieces to come together all at once, so the install goes smoothly.

While I won't have to drive the 458 miles one way to Peninsular and rent a motel room for a week, the local shop charges more per hr than Peninsular and that may wash out the delete for travel and motel. But, at least it will be local and easy to drive over and check on progress or answer questions that may come up.

Just for fun, here's a link to the company that I have lined up to do the repower.

http://www.abc-companies.com/about.asp
 
Looks like you also have a good shop that found the exhaust and wiring issue. So really good news for you is a local place that knows something.

If you don't have a road salt condition to deal with and it looks like you do... I would wrap the headers and exhaust to keep the heat down. I assume you are replacing that rusted exhaust all the way to the tailpipe?
 
Yes, I plan on replacing the entire exhaust all the way. It's my intention to either go with 3.5 or 4 inch, plus a new muffler. I'm not sure about the wrap, maybe some custom heat shields in the proper places. While we use plenty of road salt here, but I don't usually operate this in the winter and I'm not sure why it rusted out where it did.

I'm just hoping I can get this project going in time to get some traveling in this summer. It seems everyday there is some issue or conflicting information that appears about what would be the best for my application. Hopefully I can sort it out.
 
I've seen the difference in 3 1/2" vs 4" on a couple of 14' flatbeds. Go 4". Not any notice more noise but flows better keeping egt a bit lower, and according to the guy here that owns them about 1/4 more mpg. That's 0.25 more. Not a 25% increase- ha we all wish...
 
There, I did it. I mailed the downpayment check to Matt at Peninsular. Hopefully everything comes together.

I'm having him include a 4 inch adapter to the turbo for the exhaust. The installers will build the rest of the exhaust. I should probably check with them to see what muffler they would use. Maybe I should furnish my own? Heartthrob?
 
I would go to NAPA, CARQUEST, or any big truck stop and buy a 4 inch straight through diesel muffler. They're pretty quiet, flow really well, and are designed for a diesel engine so they won't plug up with soot.
 
Whatever they put on school buses would work. Looks like all of them are straight through long 4" runs. Maybe find a salvage bus? :dunno:
 
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