Electric Fan clutch

[JayTheCPA]

The HORTON is not an EV, but an on off electric fan clutch.

Gotcha . . . Yup, I had the wrong technology on the mind and knew that there was something that I was missing. Guess it would have helped had I closely read the attachments in the first post . . . Not helping my personal confusion was that I did not click on the auction site's link (NSFW) and had yet to look at the unit in discussion.

just ordered derale fan controller 16479

What is the actual EV clutch? Hayden 3264?

 

[ak diesel driver]

Yes

 

[JayTheCPA]

Thought so as that is the only Hayden EV that will fit the 6.5's spin-on water pump.

Curious, anybody else try this?

Does the motor's RPM range matter to the fan clutch construction?

Am kind of surprised that the 7.3 PowerStrokers had not done this given that the 6.5 can use the same fan clutch.

 

[schiker]

Cool.

Is this kind of sorta like an "override" circuit?
And or does the 12V power represent 100% duty cycle on the same pin as the PWM would have supplied a controlled speed?
Did ya'll talk about or elaborate on any possible stand alone PWM speed control option?

Keep us posted how you hook it up and if you are going to do an AC cut in too.

 

[ak diesel driver]

I didn't get into the specifics of the variable speed but I would assume that a varying pwm would result in varying speed. IIRC the derale controller has the capability to allow for AC function. Not sure I'm going to use it though, I don't need AC like some of you do.

 

[ak diesel driver]

Going to swap out my fan tomorrow for the bigger one.

 

[JayTheCPA]

Y'all gonna love this . . .


For grins I called Hayden's support line to ask whether the EV clutch would work with the 6.5 and was told:

- We only provide OE solutions.

- The 6.5 can only use a thermal clutch as it was not designed for the EV clutch.

- Converting from a thermal to EV clutch is far too complicated as the PCM is supposed to control it. I pointed out that Hayden sells a stand-alone PWM controller for the EV clutch but the 'too complicated to convert' aspect was stressed again.

Was not even given the opportunity to provide the EV part number.


Soooo . . . Looks like the gauntlet was laid down!

Either this will turn into a success, or we were forewarned of the failure.


One thing I do know is that the 6.0 PowerStroke uses a similar EV clutch (part #3261) and of all the issues with the 6.0, am not seeing that the fan clutch is one of them.


Seems like the remaining question is whether the fan that mates to the 3264 has enough pitch for a lower revving diesel. Maybe the one for the 7.3 or 6.0 PS?

 

[ak diesel driver]

So speaking of fans I misspoke about being able to get a bigger fan. So far haven't had much luck. the 3261 has a larger nut for mounting to the waterpump. Only would work if you made a theaded adapter. So far I'm still looking for bolt on parts. And yes depending on who you talk to at Hayden they can be very unhelpful.

 

[JayTheCPA]

Apologies, did not mean to imply that the 3261 was an option as, Correct, the bolt is too big for the 6.5's spin-on water pump. Just wanted to make the point that the EV clutch in general looks like it has success in a diesel application.


In re-reading the first post, not sold that the Motorcraft YA250 is the best option as the motors it goes with are gassers with ~5,500 RPM redlines where the fan likely has a more fine pitch than what a lower revving diesel needs.

Based on appearance, a possible fan option is the YA245 from the 6.0 PS. Another one for trial-by-error is YA255 from a 7.3 PS, but based on pics it might not fit the 3264.

If the Derale controller can automatically lock the fan at 100%, this might compensate for any pitch difference with the YA250. In looking over the Derale controller's instructions, it might only get to 60% running speed unless manually engaging the 'Override Circuit'. Presuming the Derale controller cannot get to 100% running speed without manually engaging the 'Override Circuit', might want to consider Hayden's controller which will automatically spin the fan at 100% when temperatures go 10F over the set point and then drop back to 60% at the set point.

 

[ak diesel driver]

Got my fan controller it has the ability to do an override and AC also

 

[ak diesel driver]

Fan looks pretty good on there

 

[JayTheCPA]

Got my fan controller it has the ability to do an override and AC also

The instructions are not clear as to the clutch's max RPM in 'automatic' versus override mode. In Override, it will get to 100% (but not clear at what temperature this will occur). In Automatic it gets to 60%.

That fan does look nice in there. Which one is it, the YA250?

Out of curiosity, does that clutch completely freewheel, or does it have the typical minor drag when 'Off'?

 

[Will L.]

I've spoke to several ford dealer techs, and a couple different fleet guys that are running some of the fords with these in the fleet. No one has heard of any real issues with these. 100,000 miles seemed to be the common guesstimate of life (although sooner might have given better performance since it is a fan clutch imo).

Now, if you were to hook up to a heavy trailer and burn a few hundred miles, no one will be mad at you.

 

[ak diesel driver]

Jay I don't know where your getting your info on the 60% vs 100% the derale controller is only designed for on or off. If you have another source for info please post. And yes it's the YA250 in there

 

[Will L.]

I've been thinking about that 1.7" smaller diameter fan- it has 2 more blades and by the looks of it a better rolled pitch with more surface area from hub to tip. You would have to find cfm or wind speed to know 100%, but I would think it could pull as much if not more air than the one it's replacing.

What's the cost on your set up?

 

[ak diesel driver]

So far I have $100 into the clutch and fan from a local junkyard plus about $60 for the controller. Yeah I'm wondering about the fan performance as well, 11 blades vs 9.

 

[JayTheCPA]

Jay I don't know where your getting your info on the 60% vs 100% the derale controller is only designed for on or off. If you have another source for info please post.

Many apologies, I pulled specs from one of Derale's other controllers (#16795) and not sure how I got that one as I did a cut & paste of the controller number listed in this thread (#16479). Guess I should not have trusted Google . . .


For the clutch, when it is 'Off', does it freewheel or have the typical viscous drag to it?

 

[WarWagon]

Off is 20-30% input shaft speed and on is 80-90% shaft speed.

 

[THEFERMANATOR]

For the clutch, when it is 'Off', does it freewheel or have the typical viscous drag to it?

It is just like a thermal viscous clutch except it uses an electronic control instead of the bi thermal spring. So unlocked it is just like a regualr fan clutch unlocked, and locked is the same as a fully locked in thermal clutch. The primary difference is you can control it electronically to increase airflow at idle for the A/C, and bring it in sooner to reduce temp spikes before a thermal would kick on. Also it isn't dependant on speed like a thermal unit.

 

[JayTheCPA]

It is just like a thermal viscous clutch . . .

Gotcha.

Given it acts like a regular 'ole viscous clutch, I'd just hook the controller's Override node to a switch and leave the A/C circuit out of the equation given this is closer to how the OE thermal clutch works anyway. Also, (as noted) can still manually engage the clutch while sitting still to give the A/C a boost without eating much extra fuel.