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LP fixed.. Now stalling problem

97duallydiesel

97duallydiesel

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Ok . The other thread was getting to long and I determined the problem with my lift pump not working was a faulty ground going to the pump. I ran a jumper cable directly to the negative post and it works fine now..:thumbsup:


HOWEVER , the real issue know is : We had a good snow storm two sundays ago. I plow for the state and the truck was running great up until around the 16th or 17th straight hour of running /plowing /idoling. I was at a set of lights and the truck just stalled ,luckily I was able to steer it into a parking lot and after several minutes it started right up.
It ran ok for the next 6 to 7 hrs until I parked it. The next day it didn't stall but had issues . Thru first and second gear it was running strong but when it got to third it would bog down then die./stall. This happened numerous times in the next three days so I thought it was a PMD issue. I ordered a relocator kit with PMD , harness and heat sync from Pensacola Diesel.
Yesterday , after mounting the PMD and running the truck for a test drive I came back to the house to attach my plow and the truck sputtered ,revved from 600RPM up to 1200RPM then died. This is when I went thru the process of the LP malfunction ( See other Post).
Sorry this is so long but it's the only way to describe it.

Ok LP is fixed and I take it out for a test drive . Runs like a Raped Ape :thumbsup:So I think all is well..until..I get back home and the same thing happens as before it revs bucks then dies . :mad2:
I had enough for the night so i leave it until morn. I had to work today and drove the truck ,after letting it warm up for 10-15mins , approx. 10 miles to work . At around the 6-7 mile mark the truck starts to buck and loose power blowing black smoke ,I was able to get it to work and left it there until I went home.
The same thing happens on the way home however it stalls 3 times . The truck can sit idolling forever however when it gets up to running temp around 190' this happens..
So when I get it home unplugged the new relocated PMD and plugged in the old IP mounted one. It runs fine until it gets up to the temp while driving...

The sending unit,fuel line,fuel pump (twice),fuel manager and filter where changed 3 months ago . I didn't do most of the work and I spoke to the Mechanic who did about the tank condition . He told me it has some exterior surface rust but was ok.... Please help .. another storm is coming tomm and I can't afford for this truck to sit....
 
Have you tried running with the fuel cap slightly loose?[vacume building up in the tank or wrong fuel cap]
 
when it stalls will it start right back up?

if not check the amount of fuel in the filter housing when it stalls, this will tell you if its a delivery problem to the injection pump.
 
Put a fuel guage off of the filter drain tee and use a long hose so you can see it while driving. Need to eliminate fuel system problem so we can start ruling out the possible problems.
 
ak diesel driver said:
Put a fuel guage off of the filter drain tee and use a long hose so you can see it while driving. Need to eliminate fuel system problem so we can start ruling out the possible problems.
Click to expand...

Thanks everyone.. AK once again thanks. I went to advance auto( my wife told me I should work there I'm there so much):h) and the only one they have was $45 . I really don't want to pay that for a one time check.

I'm bringing it to my buddy's shop tomm. morn. He has a fuel gauge..

The fuel cap is correct for the vehicle and is on tight . The filler neck does leak slightly when fueling up however.
 
540s10 said:
when it stalls will it start right back up?

if not check the amount of fuel in the filter housing when it stalls, this will tell you if its a delivery problem to the injection pump.
Click to expand...

It starts after some cranking . and I can here the LP briefly running.
 
97duallydiesel said:
Thanks everyone.. AK once again thanks. I went to advance auto( my wife told me I should work there I'm there so much):h) and the only one they have was $45 . I really don't want to pay that for a one time check.

I'm bringing it to my buddy's shop tomm. morn. He has a fuel gauge..

The fuel cap is correct for the vehicle and is on tight . The filler neck does leak slightly when fueling up however.
Click to expand...

They should have one of those vac/press test gauges rigs for around $20 its what I use to trouble shoot with, I keep it in my tool box
 
97duallydiesel said:
Really:confused: Hope not. This is the second one brand new in the last 3 months for $100
Click to expand...

?? You definitely shouldn't be going through lift pumps... of course, bad power does funny things to electronic/electrical items.

Fuel pressure is important... if it drops off, you'll have all kinds of issues like you are describing. Since apparently your OPS is irrelevant to the system, the only other thing in that circuit is the LP relay energized by the PCM... if you lose fuel pressure while running, it could be loss of power in the circuit, not necessarily the LP.
 
Sounds like you may have an IP issue, possibly as simple as timing (meaning TDCO stored in the PCM is not what the pump actually is). Or your Coolant Temp Sensor on the thermostat housing acting funky.

running for 16 hours straight with a dead lift pump could hurt IP, especially if you use ULSD with no good lubrication additive.

Is the IP ground still securely attached to the top of the IP? Are all three IP nuts still tight to the timing cover?

From the other thread
97duallydiesel said:
The boost goes to around 8psi and I'm running on a new oem vaccum pump and system. I also replaced the turbo relays and such. The PCM is stock.
Click to expand...

Boost is also a bit low, does it sustain at 8 or does it seem choppy (if choppy then could have vac leak).

Always wise to check LP pressure at WOT first though.
 
bison said:
sounds to me its starving for fuel.
Click to expand...

I agree but why would it run great when it's cold then like crap when it gets up to temp ? Talked to Diesel mechanic he says possibly EGR problem?I didn't think I had an EGR valve, it's not on top of the intake.

I'm Royaly bummed tho..:sad: The state called me to Plow this morning at 5:30 and I had to tell them the truck is down.. I'm losing money as we speak, going on 5hrs @ $80+hr..:mad2::mad2:

Atleast my other truck is working right now.. The mechanic works for the town and says he'll look at the truck and hook up a scanner when he stops plowing ...I never thought I would say this but I hope it STOPS snowing...

There's suppose to be a break in the storm during the day and then get bad tonight so I hope we can diagnose it before then.. My fingers are crossed...
 
IP could be suspect as well. IMO,you need to run a Fuel press gauge into the cab,you got to know whats going on with the fuel supply first before going on a chase.
.
 
I agree, best to first check LP fuel pressure while driving first.

Dont expect any old mechanic to understand what your truck needs. You are right you have no EGR. The electronic injection is particular to only this truck. The scanner has to be specific model with the correct program to do everything you need.

It sounds like a PMD problem, but you just relocated a new one right? Where is it located?

Important things to look for on the scanner is what the timing is (measured and desired and actual), what the TDCO is, and what the coolant temperature is.

For now I would say try unplugging your coolant temp sensor on the thermostat housing and see how it runs when "warmed up". The PCM will still think its really cold and have high idle and advance. Then try plugging it back in. Then try just jumpering the sensor harness with a paperclip or something, so the PCM thinks its is really hot (most of the PCM programs will advance timing when hot). IF it works fine when both unplugged and jumpered, but not when correctly plugged in, then your IP needs to be retimed most likely. You might need a new sensor, which is why you need scanner to monitor it.

When you get the scanner, see what TDCO value is. Then perform the TDCO KOKO procedure. If it comes back with a valid value but different your problem may or may not be fixed. If it comes back and is invalid and you get a DTC then you need to rotate the IP and this is likely your problem, and you need some particular wrenches or need a mechanic that has them.
 
I don't remember from the other post, did you measure how much fuel you got in one minute from the t-handle with lift pump running and engine off? I also wonder if you got the wrong sock on the new sender? We had a guy a while back on the old forum that drove him crazy until he discovered the sock was for a gas engine.
 
Buddy, I wish I had your recommendations before I went and saw my buddy the towns mechanic with the scanner. Which was a very high end one worth over $5000 running the 3.0 version. They continually update it due to it being used on town vehicles. I'm no mechanic, so I'm not sure what really was going on but i believe it was reading the fuel pressure data from the accelerator. and obviously not the actual flow from the WOT.
The scanner wasn't detecting any problems and then the truck stuttered and bucked ,almost like it coughed up something and started to run better.It also displayed an trouble code of P0251 INJECTION PUMP CAM SYSTEM

I ran fine until we brought it back to the garage then I'm not sure if they cleared the code or it did by itself but it started to stall and act up again.

He added some anti-gel/water remover they had just in case. He thought also it might be either water or rust in the fuel tank. ( I really don't believe the rust part due to the fact its only been 3 months from when I replaced the sending unit and I think it would've been acting up by now)

The truck again had the same issues down the road but when i brought it home it again hiccuped and threw the P0251 and ran fine ..
 
Well if you had a OS code like the P0251, but not the other P0370, points to a contaminated fuel problem, because the Optical Sensor (OS) in the IP needs to see throuch clear fuel. Water or air/bubbles, or dark fuel, or gunk making it cloudy can cause issues. If you use a harsh cleaner it can drag up gunk, or people that use solid lubricant cleaners like lubro molley usually have an issue. The solid lubricant can stick to parts like the OS.

I would still check the timing, and fuel pressure (which scanner does not check). Need a gauge on the line to the IP, or at least the drain line.

Temp sensor can still be an issue.

You just have to do some of the troubleshooting steps before anyone can have a better idea.
 
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