• Welcome to The Truck Stop! We see you haven't REGISTERED yet.

    Your truck knowledge is missing!
    • Registration is FREE , all we need is your birthday and email. (We don't share ANY data with ANYONE)
    • We have tons of knowledge here for your diesel truck!
    • Post your own topics and reply to existing threads to help others out!
    • NO ADS! The site is fully functional and ad free!
    CLICK HERE TO REGISTER!

    Problems registering? Click here to contact us!

    Already registered, but need a PASSWORD RESET? CLICK HERE TO RESET YOUR PASSWORD!

Injection pump timing on 6.5

G

Glenn williams

New Member
Messages
7
Reaction score
14
I have a built 6.5 with 340 hp pump for my boat that has just been assembled. I m trying to dial in the timing on the pump. The spot that the engine builder set it was hard to start So I advanced the pump a little. It started better and ran better. Seems like it needs more advance so advanced a little more. Also runs better. I want to advance a little more but I’m out of adjustment. The builder says to advance the gear that the pump is bolted to one tooth to give me more adjustment. Does this sound correct??
 
The gear would need to be rotated one direction, I can never get in my mind which direction it should travel though.
Smarter minds than mine will know.
 
While waiting for the pump master to see this,
Some of the details how the engine is built will come into play. Adding all these ntk your signature line will help not just this time around but any time in the future.

what compression? what turbo or supercharger? at what boost?
What heads? ported? What cam? Did you degree it or straight up?

Hard to start: what glow plugs and time? Are you positive there is a timing issue that is the hard start problem? High sustained rpm injection timing is not where you get easy start timing. Get it to start amazingly well and you are giving up top end hp.

How much and what color smoke are you getting while cranking before it starts.

The best move is usually dyno the engine to get the timing exactly where it performs the best, then address what it takes to start easy from there.

What is your cranking rpm?
powermaster starter with high amp batteries and 2.0 or larger cable?

Is your cold advance bypassed for the db2 build? Usually is for that kind of fuel volume.
Is the high idle solenoid there?

A video posted to YouTube and link here is a really a good thing.
 
340hp pump? Is it an old peninsular marine pump by any chance? If so that should be the 4 plunger db2.

Stock base timing on a DB2 is around 2-3* at the crank. With a total advanced of around 12-14* so total you should see 14-17* at the factory base timing. If your maxing out the pump your pushing well over 20* advance.

You can get a few more degrees if you punch out the check ball in the return fitting and adjust the LLA screw all the way out.

There is no reason to advance the pump gear if the timing advance is still functioning on the pump.
 
It has a scat crank. Ceramic coated pistons. Heads are basically stock. Not sure on the IP acquired from stanadyne a while back. The guy I bought it from at Penninsular test ran it and said it was working properly. I have a supercharger that runs at 12-13 psi wot. It runs pretty good now but flowscan shows burning more fuel than it need imo. Pyrometer goes high at wot. Like 1400. I haven’t held it there for long. Just testing at sea trial. From what I believe is that more advance will give me economy and more horsepower
 
1400 is going to make short life of those valves.
I suggest you seriously look into wmi if your supercharger/ intake design doesn’t allow for a cooler added in.

What are you timing it with? Describe and or pics of the set up on engine. Seen it done wrong a couple different ways. Which tool you have determines method.
 
I guess I was looking for a easy fix to get a little bit more adjustment on advance. I believe I only need a degree or two and it will be where I need it. I removed timing chain cover to check the marks. They look lined up. Removing the IP is a pain on this engine with the charger. Being I have the gear exposed I thought advancing the gear a tooth would give me what I’m looking to achieve without having to remove intake and everything on top of it
 
Glenn williams said:
I guess I was looking for a easy fix to get a little bit more adjustment on advance. I believe I only need a degree or two and it will be where I need it. I removed timing chain cover to check the marks. They look lined up. Removing the IP is a pain on this engine with the charger. Being I have the gear exposed I thought advancing the gear a tooth would give me what I’m looking to achieve without having to remove intake and everything on top of it
Click to expand...

Just remember, a boat runs wide open most of the time, too much advance will kill it....
 
The rods in the 6.5 are weak, period. The p400 rods exceed what the crankshaft can withstand, maybe.
you advance the timing to where the peak cylinder pressure occurs 1°too soon, and you will bend the rods. I have done it a ridiculous amount of times in the drag truck.

If you are super patient, and IF can replicate the max load everytime (maybe easier in water than on a racetrack-idk) Then you can run it at one setting, put on whatever the equal amount of 1,000 miles is, and check the glow plugs. Mic them for length, diameter, and record roughness- close up pictures. Then advance timing slightly and do another new set. Continue process until you see when deterioration is worse then back the timing off from that spot.

I asked a lot of questions above in two different posts. I wasn’t being rhetorical.
I would venture to say I have pushed more 6.5 engines to max power than anyone you will ever find. I enjoy trying to help someone but when my questions are disregarded then it quickly becomes not worth my time. Answer the questions.
 
Sorry Will idk some of the things you are asking me but I’ll try. I believe the compression is 21. It has a lysholm SC. It has 12-14 inches of boost at wot. I’m getting white smoke while cranking with a nice puff of white smoke when it fires. Idk about the IP being it was built for Penninsular engine for 340 hp from stanadyne I tried to find someone who could dyno before I put the engine back in the boat but didn’t have any luck I don’t have a timing light for this application I was hoping with the flowscan, pyrometer,and boost gauge I could get it close. When this engine was first installed in boat It worked quite well. Built and marineized by marine diesel in Sweden. It was called a hammerhead. 300 hp engine. It pushed the boat quite well. Preforming similar to the 454 BBC it replaced. I didn’t have the flowscan and pyrometer on it then so I can’t compare. The cruising speed was 20 knots at around 2800 rpm’s. And 30 knots at wot. It burned about 1/3 of the fuel than the 454 would use. So it tripled my range so I was a happy camper. I was hoping I could get similar results with new engine. On the last sea trial it was close but seemed like needed more hp and the fuel burn was like what I was getting from the 454. I read that advance of IP timing would give me the increase of hp better fuel economy. And lower egt. Like I said it seems like it is close but I have no more adjustment to advance more. I had a local diesel engine man build the engine for me. He seemed pretty confident that he could give me what I was wanting. He told me I could move gear 1 tooth in cw rotation to obtain more advance but I’ve been hesitant being the timing marks matched after removing timing chain cover. Not sure what I should do at this point
 
White smoke is either water in the cylinder or unburned fuel. If it smells like fuel, then that is what it is.

I strongly suggest focus on making it start the best you can, and go from there.

Get a Powermaster starter with 1/0 battery cables to it. Faster spinning speed means more heat and easier starts.
next would be the glow plugs. ONLY run AC Delco 60 G plugs. Add a manual start button to over ride if running an automatic glow plug relay. Cycling them twice- one time, wait a second then a second cycle and as they turn off you crank.

Proper starting procedure should be while glows are cycling go from idle to full throttle, back to idle then up to 1/4 throttle, now crank (after 2nd glow cycle).

1000 egt from a supercharger is a bit high since the exhaust is mostly free flowing and I am guessing 3” or more?
If you can read your iat post cooler, that would be good.

Finding out details about the injection pump would really help you. Incoming fuel pressure play a lot with them. 5-8psi is for stock units- but depending how it was built you might need 10, 15, 20, 25, fas less common is 30 and I have had some just over 35psi.
run too much pressure over what it was built for and you can goof some stuff up.

Also onowing what the injectors were supposed to be set for to match that pump is important.

you really need an impulse timing unit. That the kind that clamps onto the metal injection line and uses an old gasser style timing light.

Knowing if the builder advanced or retarded cam timing is critical. What camshaft and rocker arms is crucial too.
As mentioned before, bent rods for early detonation happens often. So does pistons hitting valves.

make calls, pay a couple hours shop time if needed to have them dig up records.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top