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EPA Study on Diesel Tuners

red said:
Yep grid has problems with the renewable energy options along with the constantly tightening of emission requirements on on coal/gas plants. As mentioned by Toyota and others the grid cannot expand to meet demand from electric vehicles. The failure in Texas during the storm is mostly from Ercot not doing the weather modifications they were supposed to do and shit management. Per their own numbers the online gas plants had the ability to keep the grid up if the lines hadn't frozen, wind was even putting out higher than their expected 6% at that time (was over 20% during the storm according to them despite those that were frozen).

To be economical Biodiesel from algae must be grown from wastewater sources, not farmed like Biodiesel still is. Here we harvest it from corn, one of the lowest yield plant options and highest cost but since the government subsidizes corn thats what they do. Using wastewater would bring the cost below $1 per gallon just at a slower yield rate than the current farming practice.

Tax money for each energy source is still tax money used to subsidize it, regardless of what term they use to describe it. Like saying our military doesn't have napalm since Vietnam because it was outlawed for war. We have incindigel, same thing just a different term. End Subsidies for all of them.


Refusing to make improvements just because something isn't perfect doesnt work. Just because petroleum is the cheapest option with a high enough yield rate right now doesn't mean its the only choice to stick with. Has its downsides with supply, emissions, public concerns along with government regulations that are pushing the market to change. Change is here regardless if its the cheapest or cleanest option and refusing to adapt shows that you DO need to do more research and think outside the box.
Click to expand...

If they could make biodiesel from algae for $1.00 per gallon, everyone would be making it because Dino diesel is now $3.00 to $4.00 per gallon. Hell even at it’s recent lowest point diesel was just below $2.00 per gallon here Montana. Even with the paltry margins on fuel, there would still be major financial incentives to produce it, yet they aren’t. I own a significant position in Valero, who’s a leader in oil refining as well as bio fuels. They ain’t messing with diesel from algae and don’t tell me it’s a conspiracy by the oil industry because all the diversified oil majors have been exploring it. So you DO need to do a LOT more research.
 
Big T said:
If they could make biodiesel from algae for $1.00 per gallon, everyone would be making it because Dino diesel is now $3.00 to $4.00 per gallon. Hell even at it’s recent lowest point diesel was just below $2.00 per gallon here Montana. Even with the paltry margins on fuel, there would still be major financial incentives to produce it, yet they aren’t. I own a significant position in Valero, who’s a leader in oil refining as well as bio fuels. They ain’t messing with diesel from algae and don’t tell me it’s a conspiracy by the oil industry because all the diversified oil majors have been exploring it. So you DO need to do a LOT more research.
Click to expand...

Correction $2, typo on my part before.

Conspiracy no, wastewater as the nutrient supply for the algae wasn't considered until about 9 years ago in Brazil. Brought up by scientists looking for a economical way to clean their wastewater since most of it isn't.

If you had researched to the level you are claiming this would not be news, nor would you be closed minded about options. Fact you would have pointed out the stated reasoning from some oil companies that the yield rate from a more passive algae system like that is too low for their goals. Would also be talking about hydrogen production from other sources.

Instead just going with 'nothing works besides petroleum' is essentially how you are responding in this thread. I'm all for realistic fixes to make things better, going off your replies here clearly don't have any interest in that.
 
Also the tangent on biodiesel from algae was about their overall emissions. I hadn't brought up the volume issues which can be addressed, at a certain cost. But public opinion and government regulations want clean appearing fuel source. Electric and hydrogen are the 2 that fit the clean appearance, one is far cleaner than the other in reality.
 
red said:
Yep grid has problems with the renewable energy options along with the constantly tightening of emission requirements on on coal/gas plants. As mentioned by Toyota and others the grid cannot expand to meet demand from electric vehicles. The failure in Texas during the storm is mostly from Ercot not doing the weather modifications they were supposed to do and shit management. Per their own numbers the online gas plants had the ability to keep the grid up if the lines hadn't frozen, wind was even putting out higher than their expected 6% at that time (was over 20% during the storm according to them despite those that were frozen).

To be economical Biodiesel from algae must be grown from wastewater sources, not farmed like Biodiesel still is. Here we harvest it from corn, one of the lowest yield plant options and highest cost but since the government subsidizes corn thats what they do. Using wastewater would bring the cost below $1 per gallon just at a slower yield rate than the current farming practice.

Tax money for each energy source is still tax money used to subsidize it, regardless of what term they use to describe it. Like saying our military doesn't have napalm since Vietnam because it was outlawed for war. We have incindigel, same thing just a different term. End Subsidies for all of them.


Refusing to make improvements just because something isn't perfect doesnt work. Just because petroleum is the cheapest option with a high enough yield rate right now doesn't mean its the only choice to stick with. Has its downsides with supply, emissions, public concerns along with government regulations that are pushing the market to change. Change is here regardless if its the cheapest or cleanest option and refusing to adapt shows that you DO need to do more research and think outside the box.
Click to expand...
Fuel made from sugar cane has me asking what is better the cane or the corn?
 
red said:
Correction $2, typo on my part before.

Conspiracy no, wastewater as the nutrient supply for the algae wasn't considered until about 9 years ago in Brazil. Brought up by scientists looking for a economical way to clean their wastewater since most of it isn't.

If you had researched to the level you are claiming this would not be news, nor would you be closed minded about options. Fact you would have pointed out the stated reasoning from some oil companies that the yield rate from a more passive algae system like that is too low for their goals. Would also be talking about hydrogen production from other sources.

Instead just going with 'nothing works besides petroleum' is essentially how you are responding in this thread. I'm all for realistic fixes to make things better, going off your replies here clearly don't have any interest in that.
Click to expand...

Still haven’t answered the question: If it were that cheap and easy to produce biodiesel from algae, why aren’t they doing it? 9 years Is more than enough time to build an algae to fuel processing plant.
 
Big T said:
Still haven’t answered the question: If it were that cheap and easy to produce biodiesel from algae, why aren’t they doing it? 9 years Is more than enough time to build an algae to fuel processing plant.
Click to expand...
Does BIG OIL lobby have anything to do with why no one has?
 
FellowTraveler said:
Does BIG OIL lobby have anything to do with why no one has?
Click to expand...

The major oil companies have been researching Algae based biodiesel fuel:

Renewable Biofuels: Turning Trash into Treasure — Chevron.com
  • Scalability – Given the global demand for energy, biofuels manufacturers would need tens of millions of tons of biomass annually to produce enough fuel to significantly contribute to meeting this demand. Chevron is evaluating technologies that could use our existing manufacturing facilities to produce advanced biofuels. Finding the best option is time-consuming because technology that works in the laboratory often cannot be successfully scaled to economic commercial production.
  • Cost – Biofuels manufacturers will need to drive down the costs of cultivating, harvesting and transporting biomass and must find ways to make large-scale production economical. To enable rapid market acceptance, advanced biofuels must be compatible with existing infrastructure and vehicles and must meet consumer expectations for both price and performance.
"Many technical and commercial issues must still be resolved to make biofuels available on a scale and at prices competitive with petroleum-based fuels."
 
Big T said:
The major oil companies have been researching Algae based biodiesel fuel:

Renewable Biofuels: Turning Trash into Treasure — Chevron.com
  • Scalability – Given the global demand for energy, biofuels manufacturers would need tens of millions of tons of biomass annually to produce enough fuel to significantly contribute to meeting this demand. Chevron is evaluating technologies that could use our existing manufacturing facilities to produce advanced biofuels. Finding the best option is time-consuming because technology that works in the laboratory often cannot be successfully scaled to economic commercial production.
  • Cost – Biofuels manufacturers will need to drive down the costs of cultivating, harvesting and transporting biomass and must find ways to make large-scale production economical. To enable rapid market acceptance, advanced biofuels must be compatible with existing infrastructure and vehicles and must meet consumer expectations for both price and performance.
"Many technical and commercial issues must still be resolved to make biofuels available on a scale and at prices competitive with petroleum-based fuels."
Click to expand...
It seems every year here in Florida we have major problems with water quality because of growth of non native plants and the algae is everywhere as the fish and even wild life die off from the bad water. Is this a good place to start you think?
 
Solazyme (SZYM) was the bio oil from algae IPO stock my friend was all excited about. It had shot up to a price of like $30 a share on the IPO. I told him to avoid it like the plague. Here's what I can find on them now:

TerraVia Holdings, Inc. (formerly Solazyme) was a publicly held biotechnology company in the United States. TerraVia used proprietary technology to transform a range of low-cost plant-based sugars into high-value oils and whole algae ingredients. TerraVia supplies a variety of sustainable algae-based food ingredients to a number of brands, which have included Hormel Food Corporation, Utz Quality Foods Inc., and Enjoy Life Foods.[1] TerraVia also sold its own culinary algae oil under the Thrive Algae Oil brand.

Solazyme, Inc., was founded on 31 March 2003, with the mission of utilizing microalgae to create a renewable source of energy and transportation fuels. Founders Jonathan S. Wolfson and Harrison Dillon, who met while attending Emory University, started the company in Wolfson's garage. About their partnership, Dillon said: "Neither of us wanted to go work for some giant organization where we were a tiny cog in a huge wheel. We wanted to make a difference and create something that had never existed before.”[2]

In 2013 Dillon announced his decision to step down from his full-time position as CEO and member of Board of Directors of Solazyme and shift to a long-term consulting role focused on further developing the breadth of the technology platform and advising on intellectual property strategy.[3]

Wolfson continued on as Chairman and CEO of Solazyme until August 2016 when he stepped down and assumed the role of Executive Chairman of the Board.

TerraVia appointed Apu Mody, former President of Mars Food America, as new CEO and a member of the Board of Directors, in August 2016.[4]

Initial Focus[edit]
In 2004 and 2005, Solazyme began development of an algal molecular biology platform, and identified and initiated a platform for microalgae-based oil production. The company then expanded focus on skin and personal care products.

Solazyme continued development of the algal molecular biology platform in 2006. Key microalgae strains were identified to produce oil that could be easily converted into fuels and chemicals. Through this process, Solazyme coincidentally discovered an extract from algae that demonstrated an ability to increase cell regeneration and to reduce inflammation, while protecting from UV light damage, and thereby creating alguronic acid. The company later expanded its focus to include nutrition.


Solazyme Soladiesel shown in the company laboratory.
In September 2007, Solazyme received a $2 million grant from the National Institute of Standards and Technology, signed a joint development agreement with Chevron through its division Chevron Technology Ventures, began operating in commercially sized standard industrial fermentation equipment (75,000-liter scale), worked with a third party refiner to demonstrate the compatibility of the oil with standard refining equipment, and produced over 400 liters of microalgae-based oils.

In January 2008, Solazyme was featured in Fields of Fuel, which was played at the Sundance Film Festival in Park City, Utah. At the event, it presented a Mercedes Benz C320 fueled with its Soladiesel brand of algal fuel.[5]

Also in January 2008, the company announced a partnership with Chevron Technology Ventures to explore the commercialization of algal fuel.[6] Later that year, the company stated that it had produced the world's first jet fuel derived from an algal source.

In 2009, Solazyme was awarded approximately $22 million from the United States Department of Energy for the construction of an integrated biorefinery project. It also formed a contract with the United States Department of Defense to deliver microalgae-based marine (renewable F-76) diesel fuel to the United States Navy.[7]

In 2011, the company announced it had produced over 283,000 liters of military-spec diesel (HRF-76) for the United States Navy. The initial fuel production for phase 1 of a 550,000 liter contract was completed ahead of schedule.

Initial public offering[edit]
In May 2011, Solazyme set terms for its initial public offering. The company planned to raise $160 million by offering 10 million shares at a price range of $15 to $17 and ended up selling 7,901,800 shares for $20 each in its first day of trading.[8]

Investment banking and securities firm Goldman Sachs reported in July 2011 that with the commercialization of new oil products, Solazyme stock had become less risky.[9] The bank initiated coverage with a top rating and $31 target. In a note to clients, it said Solazyme (Nasdaq: TVIA) stood to boost sales and become more stable now that it had partnered with major agribusinesses like Bunge Limited.[10]
 
More Solazyme:

Joint Venture with Bunge Limited[edit]
On 8 August 2011, Solazyme announced a joint venture with agribusiness company Bunge Limited to develop renewable oils in Brazil using Solazyme's algae-based sugar-to-oil technology.

In April 2012, Solazyme and Bunge announced a plan to construct a shared commercial-scale production facility in Brazil.[11] As one of the world's largest vegetable oil distributors, Bunge would supply the facility with sugarcane feedstock from its sugarcane processor in Brazil for use in Solazyme's algae oil production process.

Construction of the new facility began in June 2012 and in May 2014, the joint venture plant began oil production.[12]

In late 2015, Solazyme and Bunge announced an expansion of their joint venture, which included an agreement to have Bunge market the food oils produced through the joint venture.[13]

The production of AlgaPrime DHA was announced in May 2016 and is the first product under the joint venture of TerraVia and Bunge. AlgaPrime DHA is a new algae-based specialty feed ingredient designed to reduce the aquaculture industry's dependence on wild fish populations.[14][15]

TerraVia[edit]
Solazyme officially changed its name to TerraVia Holdings Inc. in March 2016 with a redefined focus on food, nutrition, and personal care. As part of the change, the company stated that its previous fuel and industrial oil products and workings would operate under Solazyme Industrials.[16]

Bankruptcy Filing[edit]
On 2 August 2017, TerraVia filed for bankruptcy protection under Chapter 11. The company announced a "stalking horse" offer from Corbion, N.V., a Netherlands food and biochemical company.[17] The offer values TerraVia's assets at $20 million.[18] By comparison, Solazyme's IPO raised over $197 million.[19]

I guess my advice was prudent.
 
Gonna jump in on the algae diesel. The same guy that I worked for on the plastics to fuel, had a 10 acre plot of algea. Be is the same guy that was working in tandem with mit on the plastic to fuel, and the ionic water purification with them.
Getting fuel that has water involved is amazingly hard to not have it damage the fuel system. Think about your current diesel and how nervous you get when someone mentions fuel bugs.

A person can argue that they can solve these issues down the road- thats what they said with gasahol, and with ethanol.
Haha.

I will be making my own at home, or switch to all gasoline or electric vehicles before going through that mess. I helped enough in the stuff to know when to run away. As for investment for making money- different story. Make money, spend money on new fuel system. See how they sound different? They are and they are both real.

Btw, the whole plastics to fuel thing cant be sustained over 100 years because on e it is scaled up- the wasting of plastic won’t happen like it does now. That’s why the big oil companies aren’t doing it long term.
 
Big T said:
Still haven’t answered the question: If it were that cheap and easy to produce biodiesel from algae, why aren’t they doing it? 9 years Is more than enough time to build an algae to fuel processing plant.
Click to expand...

I did state it in the post. As for 9 years being enough time, took over 30 years from discovering fracking technology for the oilfield to figure out how to do it economically.
 
As far as I've heard, none of the big oil players have given up on algae experimentation but as said, it's not viable economically at this point. There is also an incentive to increase grain oil bio in diesel thanks to the farm lobby. And as far as I'm concerned, I'll take my soybean oil laced fuel ANY DAY... That's proven to be great lubricity and I have 1st hand experience with it. 370,000 on a stock LBZ fuel system (now in nephew's hands) that had B5-B20 its entire life still as smooth and strong as ever.
 
They say it is ok. They said the pinto and chevelle fuel tanks were safe. So was cigarettes, atomic fall out over southern Nv, etc. i did some of the preliminary testing on peanut and other oils. The numbers were input on my end and by time they reached congress they were magically different. But the owners of the fuel company I worked for sure had extra profit that year. Hmm.

Yeah the soy bean is great. Its the alcohol thats added in to increase the water in suspension that is the problem. You mean you are never concerned about water inyour system or bugs? The worst Scenario with real#2 was minor in comparison.
 
Sooooo... About that hydrogen...

FWIW, just saw an article where the Saudis are diving into the hydrogen market in a big way. These folks do not strike me as doing half-baked ideas when it comes to energy production. Seems that they are looking to use all the desert space for collecting wind and solar energy for use in generating hydrogen. Truly would be funny if they were the first to turn-off the oil pumps.
 
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