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Broken Crank, Unknown Block, Finally Into It

coxpn2

coxpn2

coxpn2
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Location
Western New York
Awhile ago I posted a thread about an unknown block (found here: http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/showthread.php?41218-Block-Identification)
I was not able to find out who sold/built this - previous owner said he bought at an auction and it was from Canada, but doesn't remember. Mike 3500 brought up an ebay listing that seems to indicate it is theirs, but the seller claims it is not.

Irregardless, I finally pulled the oil pan off last night. First thoughts were: "I don't know 100% what I am looking for yet, but there probably is not supposed to be a bunch of shrapnel on the oil pickup tube." I'll let the pics speak for themselves (I'll see how many I can post). Anyone have any idea what this metal is from?

Well, it turns out I am having some trouble posting pics. Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but when I go to "upload" it give me an error. Is there a size limit, quantity limit? Here is a link to the DropBox folder where the pics are - let me know what you think.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/si4a03b79n55e7o/AADTD7qhbFMNqVoHtInxxEpUa

Thanks!
Patrick
 
Patrick, I'm no expert on the settings on this forum, but I to got the error message when I first tried uploading pics. I resized all my pics to 800x600 (the small web size) and everything worked perfectly. So I would try resizing them, as I would like to see your pictures.

Matt
 
Matt,
I'll try and resize them at lunchtime. In the meantime, you should be able to check them out if you click on the link I posted above. Let me know if the link works (it would be good to know for the future).

Thanks for the help!
 
Looks like bearings once upon a time. make sure to clean all the oil journals really well. big shrapnel usually leaves little particles in odd places.
 
If you still have the oil, an analysis might help out with determining if anything else is going on in addition to answering the current question.
 
That is because this site wants your pics here:
http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/showthread.php?39865-6-5-carnage

:hihi:

1024x768 will also work. Your pics are 2MB: 3264 x 2448.
Open in Paint (included in all windows versions) Use resize, select pixels, and put in 1024 - the second number should change automatically, and then save as, give it a different name. Save overwrites your original picture and some people like the full size versions so I get in the habit in case I need an enlargement of something.

Looks like it ground up a lot of metal or had coolant in the oil before the crank broke. The one rod doesn't look good - maybe just the photo angle, but, maybe bent?
I hope you didn't pay a lot for this 'mess'.
 
coxpn2 said:
Matt,
I'll try and resize them at lunchtime. In the meantime, you should be able to check them out if you click on the link I posted above. Let me know if the link works (it would be good to know for the future).

Thanks for the help!
Click to expand...
I tried that link this mornig, and it didn't work, but I tried it again now, and it works perfectly. Wow, that is some carnage. I'll be curious to see pics as you finish the tear down. Thanks

Matt
 
Cool, it worked!

When I bought the truck I knew it had a broken crank, so I figured I'd be into it for another engine. I bought a donor truck and took the engine out, so suburban is currently running on that one. When I got time I figured I'd tear into this one and see if it is worth rebuilding.

My next course of action is to look into what I can do now, with the engine as it sits, to try and find out what happened. AKA - why the crank broke, what all of the metal slivers are from, and why the oil looks like it was run with coolant in it. The oil analysis seems like a decent idea, but it has had coolant sitting with the oil for about a year - so would that explain the sludge? I wouldn't think it would mix just by sitting, and therefore doesn't seem to explain the sludge... at least that's my thinking...?

Any other ideas as to what the metal is and what I should do before I keep digging?
 
coxpn2 said:
. . . it has had coolant sitting with the oil for about a year - so would that explain the sludge? I wouldn't think it would mix just by sitting, and therefore doesn't seem to explain the sludge... at least that's my thinking...?
Click to expand...

Not sure what coolant just sitting in the oil pan looks like, but definitely know what running the engine with coolant in the oil looks like: black sludge and high metal contents (yes, plural) in the analysis report. And No, the engine will seem like it is running just fine with a coolant leak into the oil (old saying of 'don't ask how I know' applies here).

Did see results from gassers that ingested water and immediately shut down; in those cases it was a simple fix of draining water out of the oil pan. With the presence of sludge in this case, need to find the coolant source (head, head gasket, cylinder . . .) and decide on a course of action from that point.
 
Took a second look at the pics. Are you positive that sludge is from coolant and not water? At this point, only likely value the analysis will give is whether it is coolant or water and help focus whether or not to look for any coolant leaks during the tear-down.
 
JayTheCPA said:
Took a second look at the pics. Are you positive that sludge is from coolant and not water? At this point, only likely value the analysis will give is whether it is coolant or water and help focus whether or not to look for any coolant leaks during the tear-down.
Click to expand...

No idea if it is coolant or water. I bought the suburban in the summer of last year - it had been sitting for a year prior at the guys house. He had the heads off when it was sitting (hood was still on the truck though).

I pulled it last summer/fall and it's been sitting with the heads off in a garage until now.
 
My 2 cents is save the time and $ on the analysis. If you don't find coolant what does that mean, maybe he was on just water. Rip it all apart. Anything you reuse has to be carefully checked anyways.

I agree with the bent rod look. My guess is lost a head gasket or head, water in the oil lost viscosity, wiped the bearings, and kept running down the road long enough to put water in a cylinder bend a rod a little and snap the crank. obvious crank junk, bent rod(s), and possible toasted block and head. Very easily could have wiped the thrust on the mains. 2nd to last pic looks like some block and main cap got milled.
I would magnaflux the heads and verify straight before running them on something. Check the timing set as well, snapped cranks can wipe them out.

Pull the oil pump apart and check for scratches and of coarse clearances, could be salvageable. Fingers crossed for lots-o- parts good...
 
This is very helpful, although I have diminished hopes for salvage ability now though!
I'll start taking things apart and see what I can find... also probably label each piece and where it came from for future diagnostics.
 
Nobody caught the broken main caps! (I think that is what they are called, whatever the "U" shaped things are that hold the bearing/crank in. Picture 2nd from the bottom.

Took them off and 3 of the 4 were broken right in half. A couple of the bearings are trashed too... this thing looks pretty rough.
 
Lil bit of jb weld and she will be just fine...

How's the cam mic out? Something's gotta be good for the parts shelf.
 
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