6.5coalroller
New Member
Anyone ever put a jake brake on a 6.5. I dont really know much about them but i'm sure some one on here could explain how one works. But they do sound cool :smile5:
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jake brake
- Thread starter 6.5coalroller
- Start date
Idle_Chatter
(A)ACLU #79
Can't put one on your 6.5. A Jake brake (short for Jacobs Vehicle Systems) is a hydraulic override of the exhaust valves on large diesels that allows compression pressure to "bleed" out the exhaust and up the stacks. Best you can do is an exhaust brake, a flapper in the exhaust header that creates backpressure on the exhaust, but no cool sound. Sorry.
http://www.jakebrake.com/products/how-the-jake-brake-works.php
http://www.jakebrake.com/products/how-the-jake-brake-works.php
Acesneights1
New Member
To my knowledge no one makes one. You could try an exhaust brake. Similiar. Jake is sol operated to cause backpressure in the cyl. by cutting the fuel.
Here I copied this. it says it better.
In a semi engine, air enters the intake valve and is forced into the cylinder and compressed. As the piston inside the cylinder moves downward, it pushes the energy from the compressed air to the wheels and produces power.
So you're all revved up. Now how are you going to slow down? Enter the compression-release engine brake. When approaching a steep downhill grade, truck drivers will flip a switch in the cab to shut off whatever number of engine cylinders they need to slow the truck. The shut off cylinders receive air, but they do not pass energy back through the system. Instead, the piston pushes the compressed air out the exhaust valve at the top of the cylinder and effectively slows the rig [source: Jacobs Vehicle Systems].
Here I copied this. it says it better.
In a semi engine, air enters the intake valve and is forced into the cylinder and compressed. As the piston inside the cylinder moves downward, it pushes the energy from the compressed air to the wheels and produces power.
So you're all revved up. Now how are you going to slow down? Enter the compression-release engine brake. When approaching a steep downhill grade, truck drivers will flip a switch in the cab to shut off whatever number of engine cylinders they need to slow the truck. The shut off cylinders receive air, but they do not pass energy back through the system. Instead, the piston pushes the compressed air out the exhaust valve at the top of the cylinder and effectively slows the rig [source: Jacobs Vehicle Systems].
Acesneights1
New Member
we must have been posting at the same tme. Your link is better.
Acesneights1
New Member
They also beat the crap out of the drive train and engine if used improperly(which most of the time they are( Nothing like getting next to an old lady in a k car with a 444 BC and 6 inch straght pipe and hittin the jake :devil: ) On Macks the wore out the cams on certain engines not originally equipeed with Dynatard.
- Staff
- #6
LOL... they do, at that. A 3-stage Jake going downhill in the mountains is one of my favourite sounds...
But you can't have one.
You can have an exhaust brake (Extarder), but not a true Jacobs Enging Retarder Brake.
A Jake Brake turns your engine into an air compressor, rather than an air pump. Variable jakes (like on my old 350 Cummins), can be set for 1, 2, or 3 cylinders of compression... depending on how much you want your engine to retard your vehicle. Rather than the expansion of the ignited fuel pushing your pistons, your pistons are doing the work of compressing air using the momentum of your driveline.
It works by activating an extra valve on your cylinders, which the cam then opens (there is an extra lobe for that, too), changing the way your cylinders normally work.
Normally, your piston compresses all the way to tht top on the upstroke. This compression takes energy from your driveline and is a loss of power. The fuel ignites at the top and pushes the piston through the downstroke. The power you make from that cylinder is = (power gained on the downstroke) - (power lost on the upstroke). What the Jacobs brake does is open the cylinder at the top, releasing the compressed air. The loss of compression means you get no power on the downstroke, so your cylinder is in a dead loss state throughout the cycle.
The valve is electrically controlled by a solenoid which extends/contracts the valve stem - that way, it stays out of the way when you don't need it, but when you flip the switch and take your foot off the APP, the Jake kicks in and slows you down.
That's why you can't have one... the 6.5 has no provision for this extra valve, solenoid, or pressure routing. What you CAN have is an exhaust brake... by restricting the outward flow of exhaust, this device makes it harder for your engine to push the exhaust out, increasing backpressure and bleeding off energy from your drivetrain.
My CAT diesel in my motorhome doesn't have all this fancy valving,either, but it has a Jacobs Extarder system... an exhaust brake.
I really liked the jake in my old Kenworth... you get used to shifting with a Jake on, as the engine drops RPMs so fast you can go through the gears in a big hurry (without waiting for the engine to slow down).
Bet you wish you hadn't asked that question, huh?
- Staff
- #7
wow - you guys are good... there was no answers when I started typing ...
... which tells you something about my typing speed ):h
... which tells you something about my typing speed ):h
Acesneights1
New Member
All I know is they sound cool and scare old ladys...:rofl:
And Cummins is the king of engine to have a Jake and pipes..
And Cummins is the king of engine to have a Jake and pipes..
6.5coalroller
New Member
lol kinda sounds like a stupid question now but I understand them now. They are fun tho me and my friend were driving there farms semi around at midnight one night throwin the jake brake on past every house lol
Doing that around here would be a good way get .30 cal holes in your truck! :nono:
MAGNUM SERVICES
Intelligence Guided By Experience
A lot of little cities have ordinances against Jake Brake usage because of everyone removing the mufflers off their big rigs!
Anubis
Being fat sucks
if you want something that is functional...... I saw a device at GATS a couple years ago that was a magnetic driveshaft brake....... I'll be damned if i can find any information on it now.
Dave Barbieri
Member
You're thinking of a driveline retarder. Ambulances and some motor homes use them to save wear on pads and shoes. Big, heavy and man do they get hot in operation! Our tranny dyno used two of them to simulate load. Very cool and VERY effective. Here's more info on how they work:
http://www.ehow.com/how-does_5542666_driveline-retarder-works.html
And these folks supply a lot of the units used in the US:
http://www.industrialautomatic.com/html/telma1.htm
Anubis
Being fat sucks
Thats the one ...... thats the one I saw at GATS. I wanted to get one for my 460 powered motorhome.
now i got the pick up and the 5'er so i would still like to get one.
HighSierra86
Active Member
Seeming how this is close to the origonal topic........what are everyone's thoughts on an exhaust brake? I was seriously contamplating one on my 96' with the 5spd, but then I heard someone saying that the increased back pressure was causing problems with the piston rings.
Not the same sound as a jake brake, but the same purpose
Not the same sound as a jake brake, but the same purpose
Take you foot off the accelerator and the diesel to the injectors is cut off at any speed over idle RPM.
This is why people want more braking as the diesel engine has already cut fuel.
They say the LMM engines can experience engine damage from a plugged DPF - from getting fuel and a restricted exhaust... But think of the combustion pressure the engine deals with and the fact that the exhaust brakes let some air by. How is an exhaust restriction going to hurt your engine when it isn't getting any fuel? No fuel - no heat. So the normal damaged of a crushed exhaust pipe overheating things does not apply. You have a large 6.5L air compressor with an exhaust brake on.
I imagine that 21:1 compression ratio will blow the exhaust up before it hurts the engine. But you should never have that much restriction with an exhaust brake.
This is why people want more braking as the diesel engine has already cut fuel.
They say the LMM engines can experience engine damage from a plugged DPF - from getting fuel and a restricted exhaust... But think of the combustion pressure the engine deals with and the fact that the exhaust brakes let some air by. How is an exhaust restriction going to hurt your engine when it isn't getting any fuel? No fuel - no heat. So the normal damaged of a crushed exhaust pipe overheating things does not apply. You have a large 6.5L air compressor with an exhaust brake on.
I imagine that 21:1 compression ratio will blow the exhaust up before it hurts the engine. But you should never have that much restriction with an exhaust brake.
Anubis
Being fat sucks
I have an automatic, I would like to find an NV4500 and a gear splitter then the exhaust brake would work fine. It does not work with the automatic..... there is a torque converter lock up mod but I was also told this would damage the transmission..... I don't want to be dealing with replacing an A4LD on the side of the freeway hooked to a 7500 pound 5th wheel......
there has to be a way to work the logic in the switch so the TC only stays locked up if the exhaust brake is on and then the operation is seamless.
I had a switch on the E40D in my Bronco that I could lock up the TC in any gear at any speed, but would unlock when I used the brakes....... the same switch also reversed the overdrive logic so OD off was the default setting on start up.....
there has to be a way to set up the logic so the TC would stay locked up with power supplied to the exhaust brake in drive and overdrive, cut the power to EB an unlock the TC below 25mph (unless momentarily and manually over ridden)
there has to be a way to work the logic in the switch so the TC only stays locked up if the exhaust brake is on and then the operation is seamless.
I had a switch on the E40D in my Bronco that I could lock up the TC in any gear at any speed, but would unlock when I used the brakes....... the same switch also reversed the overdrive logic so OD off was the default setting on start up.....
there has to be a way to set up the logic so the TC would stay locked up with power supplied to the exhaust brake in drive and overdrive, cut the power to EB an unlock the TC below 25mph (unless momentarily and manually over ridden)
Matt Bachand
Depends on the 6.5
I never liked the TC releaseing with brake applied either while slowling down... I always dump down to 3rd from OD before hitting brake pedal.
todd
New Member
a universal exaust retarder can be had aftermarket through dick laing diesel but it beats the engine also most ud,volvo,and nissan medium duty have the option so can be swapped ir u find one in a junk yard but if you do let me know what junk yard you use as i will wait and check ( i need parts )lol they can beat the hell out of your turbo and heads. one of my favorite sounds is loghting up the jake up on my cranked up 12.7 detroit with straight pipes in the lehigh tunnel evil i know but fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!