hard starting am, and blow bye

[k8ble]

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6.5 Engine Diagnostic Troubleshooting Checklist


Copy and paste this checklist into a new post, then answer all the questions by typing in your data into the (red) blanks as indicated - click in the middle of the blank, start typing.


Problem: Explain your problem in concise language (ie: Cranks but won’t fire). _hard starting after sitting a few days___________________________

Demographics: tell us about your truck and your ambient conditions:

- Year: _95_____
- Truck model and class (ie: c2500) _k3500________
- Automatic or Standard ___auto_______
- Mileage: (indicate miles or km) _261000________
- Replaced parts and mods (IP, PMD, chip/PCM, TM, injectors etc) _glow plugs wring__________
- Model: ‘S’ or ‘F’ engine, NA or Turbo, EGR? ___F turbo___________
- Ambient outside temp: (indicate *C or *F) __35 f________
- What fuel are you using? (#1 Diesel, #2 Diesel, Bio, VO, WVO, etc) __1_______
- What fuel additives are you using? ___0________
- Where are you located? _minnesota____________

General maintenance: inspect and evaluate the condition of each. When were they last changed?
- Air filter __ok_______
- Fuel filter _?________
- CDR Valve? _unknown/suspect________
- Coolant – last flushed/replaced at __?___________
- Oil – synthetic/regular, changed at ___?________
- Batteries – state of charge, (matched set) replaced at _11/20/09____________
- Battery cables and grounds (removed, cleaned and tightened): ___11/20/09__________
- Glow Plugs - how many miles on them? _5________ What type? _____________
- Injectors - last changed at ___?____________


History: (Describe how the problem first appeared.)
- What were you doing when it happened? __replaced trans____________
- How was the truck running fine before this problem appeared? ____below average_________
- Has this problem ever happened before? _______________________
- Describe any related factors that might be part of the problem. ___cdr,vac pump___________
- Have you checked for DTC (Diagnostic Trouble Codes)? (Y.N) __n__ And? ________


Diagnostics:

1] Starting:
1a] Does the engine start? __yes_______
1b] Does the engine crank over? ___yes_____
1c] Are your batteries fully charged? _yes________
1d] Have you removed, cleaned, and tightened all battery connections? __yes______
1e] Does your Wait to Start light come on for a time? How long? ___8sec______
1f] Does your glow plug light come on? __yes 8sec_______ For how long? _________
1g] Do you see smoke from the exhaust while cranking? What color? _white_______
1h] Does the Service Engine Light Glow during Start/bulb check? _?_______

2] Fuel Issues (if not running):
2a] Can you hear your lift pump working? ____________
2b] Do you get a steady flow of fuel from the water drain (T-handle) ? _________
2c] Loosen the inlet line from the IP – is fuel coming out (Lift Pump on)? ___________
2d] Loosen an injector line and crank the engine - does fuel come out? _________
2e] Do you hear a vacuum (hiss) when you remove the fuel cap? ___________

3] PMD / IP Issues
3a] Location of PMD (on pump, on intake, remote mounted) ___________
3b] Condition of Extension harness (if used) Vendor or Homemade? _________
3c] Condition of grounds / ground wires to IP / PMD. Check Harness. _________
3d] PMD Make: ___________
3e] PMD Age: _____________

4] Stalling Issues
4a] Do you experience stalling only when hot? ____________
4b] Does it stall under particular circumstances? (ie hit bump, or on accel) ______
4c] Does pouring cool water over the IP seem to help with restarting? _________
4d] Is stalling momentary (engine recovers)? _________
4e] Does SES light come on when engine hiccups? _________
4f] Does cruise control quit working when engine hiccups? ___________
4g] Does re-starting seem to reset engine, restoring cruise and power? _________
4h] Changes to dash lights or instruments during stalling events? ___________

5] Running Issues
5a] On cold start, does upper rad hose get hard before engine warms up? _______
5b] Any bubbles or oil film in coolant overflow tank? _______
5c] Any white slime on oil surfaces (dipstick, CDR, oil Fill cap)? __________
5d] Excessive white smoke from exhaust on cold start? _________
5e] Excessive black smoke from exhaust under hard acceleration? __________

6] Performance Issues
6a] Do you have gauges (boost, EGT) ? ___________
6b] Maximum boost under load? ____________
6c] Have you added a performance PCM (reflash) or Chip? ______________
6d] Have you changed exhaust / downpipe / crossover? ________________
6e] Wastegate – mechanical or vacuum (OEM)? _________?_____

7] Temperature-related Issues:
7a] Single or dual thermostats? __?__________
7b] Have you replaced them lately? Manufacturer of replacements? ____no_____
7c] Have you pulled and cleaned Radiator and coolers lately? __no__________
7d] Have you replaced the fan clutch? Manufacturer of replacement? ___no_____
7e] (winter) Have you tested your antifreeze? Good to what temp? __yes -40________
7f] (winter) Are you using a winter grille cover? __no_________

List and describe any other factors which are not addressed in this checklist. We can’t see, hear, smell, or touch your truck, so the more descriptive information you can give, the more likely it is that somebody can assist you.

_has blow buy out of dip stick, hard starting after a few days left alone________________________________
__________________

Please include your vehicle details in your signature. Click here to fill out yours.


If you need assistance with your 6.5TD, please copy our Diagnostic Checklist and start a new thread by pasting it and filling it out in detail.

 

[duramaxdude]

Check your lift pump. If its shot it might let fuel drain backwards into the tank if it sits for a while. When my lift pump went last time it would be hard to start and would hiccup until system was bled again.

 

[Mudbath]

How old are the glow plugs? Are they 15G or 60G glow plugs. The old 15g glows have a habit of burning up. Maybe pull some from the drivers side and see what they look like.

 

[iamdave0887]

How old are the glow plugs? Are they 15G or 60G glow plugs. The old 15g glows have a habit of burning up. Maybe pull some from the drivers side and see what they look like.

15g? Only ones i've heard of are the 9G, 11G, or 60G from Acdelco for the 6.5. The 9G's would swell and burn out, the 11Gs would just burn out(although i have a swollen and burned out 11G) and the 60Gs are the self regulating which will take some more glow time to heat up.

 

[Mudbath]

Yes 15g is what I took out of mine. But all previous to 60g seem to burn up prematurely. Love the 60g but in my colder climate you do need the glow plug over ride mod.

Just checked and my old ones were the 11g, the 15g were the Hummer 6.2/6.5. You can't beat the 60g which can replace all previous.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ACF-15G

 

[knkreb]

See also if plugging in block heater overnight will make any difference on startup...

That lift pump is a good thing to test too... like duramaxdude said....

 

[k8ble]

thanks to all , i think i'll check out my lift pump, the 60g's are great but would like to know more about the glow plug delay trick.. thanks k8ble

 

[Missy Good Wench]

If your engine is in good shape, especially the injectors and the IP it should start right off with one normal glow cycle using the 60G plugs.

The 9G plugs were the early ones and would burn out and puff up like a poisoned chipmunk.

The 11G plugs were ok but were replaced by the 60G

I have never seen a 15G but there are always things out there that get missed.

I used 60G plugs in DaHoooley and it fires right off with one glow cycle and zoop off to the rodeo.

Used up and worn out injectors are more the cause of poor cold starts than many folks care to notice.

Once the pop pressure drops off the injectors start to PEEEEEEEEE a stream rather than spray a fine cone of fuel mist.

This results in loads of blue/white smoke and tough running on startup.

If fresh glow plugs do not eliminate the cold start issues and there does not seem to be fuel supply problems then the injectors are to be suspect.

100K miles on the injectors and they are likely used up.

Poor injectors also can lead to "HOT spots" in the engine due to poor fuel delivery.

Poor injectors can cause high EGTs as the fuel delivery is sloppy and some of it is still burning as it leaves the engine.


Missy

 

[Mudbath]

Here is the procedure for the over ride. I would only do it with the 60g glows myself. It would burn the smaller ones up I think. What protects the 60g is it is self limiting.

http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/showthread.php?t=5440

 

[iamdave0887]

Yes 15g is what I took out of mine. But all previous to 60g seem to burn up prematurely. Love the 60g but in my colder climate you do need the glow plug over ride mod.

Just checked and my old ones were the 11g, the 15g were the Hummer 6.2/6.5. You can't beat the 60g which can replace all previous.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ACF-15G

interesting, the 15G plugs seem to be the 24 volt plugs. They look similar to the ones kenny was describing(with the bullet connector) when i was over there that day.

You can also do the override with the Duraterm glow plugs. However i do believe the Duraterms do not need as much override time to get up to full temp.

 

[Mudbath]

Apparently they are Military issue.


Notes Fits 24 valve miltary version.

 

[iamdave0887]

Apparently they are Military issue.


Notes Fits 24 valve miltary version.

I saw that too. interesting with the 24 valve part? no way that's possible. to have 24 valves you'd need a 6 cyl w/ 4 valves per cylinder or a 4 cyl with 6 valves per cylinder .

they probably meant 24 volt military version.

 

[DEERE3594]

I think they meant 24 volt

 

[Mudbath]

Never heard of it either but is probably 1 intake and 2 exhaust or 2 intake and 1 exhaust valve per cylinder.

I would like to have a set though. :thumbsup:

 

[packratt]

If it has 24V plugs installed they probably aren't working at all since our trucks are 12V.