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Died on the road

alphadeltaromeo

alphadeltaromeo

Diesel Enthusiast
Messages
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Location
GA
Morning:

Driving to the FOX Theater in Atlanta last night for an event, we were 5 mins from arrival when I accelerated, black smoke resulted, and it just died. I was unable to get it started.

I put in the spare PMD and nothing. I'm thinking fuel pump or pump relay. Seems to be to be a fuel delivery issue. I didn't loosen the FM while cranking...had it towed and have the batt's charging presently.

Recommendations for other potential issues? I'd greatly appreciate input before I start testing after batt's charge.

Grateful,

Andy
 
Be sure you are getting fuel to the filter and to the IP when cranking. If not then the issue is either a lift pump or a filter issue.

Be sure that the fuel shut off on the IP is working (should click when the key is turned on)

If this still brings no joy then the issue is deeper. Be sure the ECM fuse is OK

Keep us posted

Missy
 
Agree with MGW, first thing to check is LP and OPS since it is a 94.
OPS can give up anytime causing the LP not to run although theoretically it should not.

Fuel filter can be clogged.

Also check all the electricals.

How is the fuel level?
 
Update:

Charged batts, checked FM to ensure fuel was flowing...it was. Forgot that the GP and SES light had been coming on, so realized the ECM fuse must be OK. It started right up without issue. So...again I was driving, pumped the peddle hard and black smoke...like popped the peddle and it just died. What do you think could have been the issue with doing what I did?
 
1st, never crank a diesel till the batteries get low. It just cooks off the starter. If it doesn't start in under 30 seconds with 3-4 attempts it isn't going to start. Low batteries will reduce cranking speed till it will not start even with the problem fixed. And if it does start the low batts cook the alternator quickly. (I have eaten too many this way myself.)

Black smoke can be from running out of fuel at the IP. Test LP pressure and check the filter including the water drain for water. Check for a hiss at the tank when the cap is loosened. Check the last ditch screen in the FFM. Check for air with a clear IP return line.

A WAG is that you are getting air, smoking as air mucks up the IP, and air locking the plungers to a hard start condition. This would explain long cranking to start as the IP re-primes the injector lines.

Unrelated the black smoke can be from turbo WG issues and you have a separate issue causing the stalling and no start.

Check for codes.

Check the grounds.
 
On a 94, fuel can flow when cranking but stop as soon as it starts???

Do the proper test, when engine runs, open the t-valve and see if the fuel pours and engine stays running.

It can also be the PMD, where is the PMD??? Is your spare known to be good?
 
WarWagon said:
1st, never crank a diesel till the batteries get low. It just cooks off the starter. If it doesn't start in under 30 seconds with 3-4 attempts it isn't going to start. Low batteries will reduce cranking speed till it will not start even with the problem fixed. And if it does start the low batts cook the alternator quickly. (I have eaten too many this way myself.)
Click to expand...

:agreed::thumbsup:
Not to mention, put's more stress on already weak starter bolts...
Try Sight glassing it..
 
Point of clarification...I was only able to crank it 4 times at less than 10 seconds per crank cycle. The batts are quite old and just died. The black smoke was because I gunned it in ATL traffic :) So when I gunned it, the puff and dying. As a note I've driven it approx 50 miles today without issue. The only code is the IP pulse width error (long) that I've had for quite some time. The PMD is new from Heath...the old one I keep in the burb just to validate the system in the event of issues.

Anyway, it's running, so I'm just pleased I don't have to invest any money other than the tow bill. If I wasn't downtown and concerned about getting a parking violation, I would have just let it sit until we were done at the FOX. I was in a heavy traffic path, so getting it out of the way was critical.
 
A pulse width error (LONG) is an indication that there is trouble with the IP internally.

My guess is that the fuel solenoid (internal on that actually controls the fuel) is taking a poop.

Add some fuel conditioner or two stroke oil to the fuel tank and run the thing.

When the solenoid starts to get worn out it can "Bind" some and this can result in the response time error.'

The ECM commands the fuel solenoid to move in response to the throttle requirements and then the ECM expects a signal back from the solenoid within a few miliseconds and if the response is not within the parameters that are set in the software the code is set and the SES light comes on.

The fuel conditioner or oil may help, but only for just so long. IMHO an IP is in your future.

Missy
 
I get reminded how hard diesels are on batteries every so often. I forget about em going bad...
 
There was a issuie with the electronic 6.5s when they were new that a sudden tap to the pedal would kill the engine. Most were fixed under warrenty but it may have been one of those only if it does it things.It does sound like a fuel solenoid problem.
If you get the code off the chip in the ECM ,Buddy can tell you if it has been updated or not. Since it is a 94 it may have [or had] the oddball IP[5068?] If the IP was updated and the chip wasn't ,they will do odd things.
 
Interestingly enough, the IP was put in new prior to myself purchasing the vehicle. Perhaps the PO wasn't be honest with me about that...but it surely looked new. I did have to time it correctly after purchasing it though. Perhaps the IP isn't calibrated correctly vs. the FS being defective? Per Buddy's recommendation a while back, I had been putting in 2 cycle, but that didn't do anything for the IP response time long. It was quieter though :)

Yes, these batts need a home in the ground, but they still work most of the time, so I'll drive them into the ground...or close to it rather.
 
It could be a reman but the question is who did it ? There are alot of hacks.....Aside from maybe Accurate Diesel, I usually go local. Heath sells new ones but I never keep anything long enough to spend that kind of scratch.
 
List of woe's increasing. Started burb the other day and it ran fine. Driving down the road it decided not to shift and any amount/variation of throttle pushing didn't do anything, not even revving up. Drifted off road and shut her down. Started back up and she ran without issue.

More...can start her up and then put her in gear and she dies. Let her really warm up well and then she's fine, but it's getting more prominent when out and about. Obviously need to get this resolved.

Here is a list of the DTC's

DTC 16 - Vehicle Speed Sensor Buffer Fault
DTC 19 - Crankshaft Position Reference Error
DTC 18 - Pump Cam Reference Pulse Error
DTC 28 - Transmission Range Pressure Switch Circuit
DTC 35 - Injection Pulse Width Error (Time Short)
DTC 36 - Injection Pulse Width Error (Time Long)
DTC 41 - Brake Switch Circuit Fault
DTC 54 - PCM fuel circuit error
DTC 78 - Turbo Wastegate Solenoid Fault
DTC 85 - Transmission Gear

Could it be the plugin module on the side of the tranny? Other thoughts?

Andy
 
The PCM outputs voltage to most of the sensors, so its all over, so if like an IAT or CTS or APP sensor were shorted could cause a bunch of issues.

How long have these codes been around? I would clear them all and see what comes back. some of them are likely not related to others. It just seems like something just had a glitch though.
 
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