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SAE hose ratings & Viton hose cost ratings & useage???

Crankme69

New Member
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7
Location
Illinois the Corruption Capitol of USA
Thread starter #1
I spent the better part of the day searching the net trying to determine what fuel hose should be used & I know less now then when I started. The only thing I have learned is the cost of the so called Bio rated rubber fuel hose from Napa is $12 a foot & that ain't gonna happen. I'll get creative with brake line or copper tubing before I spent 12 bucs a foot.

The rubber fuel hose I recently installed on my 6.5 fuel return line to replace the rotten steal one on the frame is rated SAE 30R7 & that cost me 3.99 a foot at Autozone for 10 feet, absolutely ridiculous $$$ IMO!

Please educate me...

TIA
 

Crankme69

New Member
Messages
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Location
Illinois the Corruption Capitol of USA
Thread starter #3
Here in ILL most all the #2 fuel pumps contain a sticker that reads "fuel can contain up to 10% bio diesel blend"

I have no immediate plans to run anything but #2 presently, but am looking for info on the rubber hose ratings. If I have to spend $12 a foot I will be looking for alternatives for steal line replacements to minimize the amount of hose I need.

Any info on the fuel hose I installed that is rated SAE 30R7?
 
Messages
13,286
Likes
3,511
Location
alaska
#5
Products > Hoses > Fuel

Application:
A multipurpose fuel hose that can be used a fuel line, PCV connection, emission control line or fuel return line.

Specific Fuel:
Leaded and unleaded gasoline, diesel fuel, gasoline blends of ethanol (E10), E-85 and sour gas.

Construction:

Tube: Black Chemigum (NBR)
Reinforcement: 2-Spiral Synthetic
Cover: Black Hypalon* (CSM)

Temperature Range F & C: -40˚F to +257˚F (-40˚C to +125˚C)
SAE Specifications: SAE J30R7
Goodyear EP Specifications: 580019
Length: See table below. 1.6', 2' (clamshell), 25' (spool), 250' (reel)
Brand Layline: 5/16" (7.9mm) 50 psi Fuel/Emission SAE J30R7
Made in USA Goodyear
Installation: See selection of Goodyear Engineered Products clamps and connectors
 
Messages
13,286
Likes
3,511
Location
alaska
#8
December 2004
Form No.: 433-0780
Avoid comebacks, install permeation-resistant fuel line hose
Fuel line hoses carry gasoline from the tank to the
fuel pump, to the fuel filter, and to the fuel injection
system. While much of the fuel lines are rigid tube,
sections of it are made of rubber hose, which
absorb engine and road vibrations.
There are two basic types of fuel hose: Fuel and oil
hoses that meet the SAE 30R7 standard, and fuel
injection hose that meets the requirements of SAE
30R9.
Standard fuel and oil (SAE 30R7) hose is rated for
low-pressure applications at 50 psi working
pressure up to 3/8" size, and 35 psi for sizes over
3/8". This general-purpose hose contains a light
reinforcement, and the rubber materials can be any
compound that is suitable for fuel, oil and vapors.
However, Gates Corporation engineers warn
installers that fuel formulations at many US
refineries are constantly changing as proprietary
blends are introduced according to government
mandates and seasonal influences. At times, more
aggressive fuels can extract the oils that give SAE
30R7 hose its flexibility. The result is a brittle, stiff
tube that will greatly reduce the performance and
service life of the hose.
Fuel injection (SAE 30R9) hose or MPI (multi-port
injection) hose is reinforced to handle higher
pressures up to 180 psi. It can be used on all
injection systems that use hose clamps. It is not
designed to replace coupled assemblies on fuel
injection systems.
Fuel injection hose is designed for low permeation
contact with a wide variety of alcohols, alcohol fuel
blends, and diesel fuel. It allows 15g/m2/day
permeation whereas standard SAE 30R7 hose
allows 550g/m2/day. (Gates fuel injection hose
routinely performs at 1 to 2g/m2/day of fuel loss,
well below the allowable standard.)
Gates SAE 30R9 hose uses a laminated tube of
Fluoroelastomer, as a thin wall inner layer backed
by traditional compounds. This first layer protects
the rest of the hose from attack, swelling or
permeation from aromatics, oxidized gasoline (as
can occur in fuel injection systems), ethanol or
oxygenate additives and a wide range of petroleum
based products.
The laminated tube will resist cracking caused by
"sour gas," which forms when unused gas is
returned to the fuel tank. As an added benefit, this
hose construction reduces emissions because fuel
can't evaporate through the hose walls.
SAE30R9 hose is also recommended for diesel
fuel because its fluoroelastomer tube resists
deterioration caused by some diesel fuel additives.
As refineries produce cleaner fuels and lower
allowable permeation rates during the “vehicle at
rest” condition, older hose specifications such as
SAE 30R7 are becoming less reliable. This type of
hose is no longer specified on OEM automotive
fuel applications because of stringent permeation
standards.
Therefore, Gates engineers assert that the best
choice for automotive fuel line hose applications
today is fuel injection SAE30R9 hose. For
installers, it is the best choice for reduced
comebacks and for high performance, assured
trouble free service in a changing fuel environment.
Finally, for submersible applications such as on the
in-tank fuel pump, only SAE30R10 hose should be
used, because when the hose fails, the pump will
fail. Hose construction consists of low swell
fluoroelastomer compounds in the tube and cover
that resist gasoline and diesel fuel permeation and
aging. Standard hoses have these fuel-resistant
characteristics in the tube portion only.
Contact your Gates jobber for information on Gates
MPI/fuel injection hose and submersible fuel line
hose.
Gates Corporation
PO Box 5887, Denver, Colorado 80217
 

btfarm

330,000 Worth and counting
Staff member
Lead Moderator
Messages
16,826
Likes
2,812
Location
Sandwich, Illinois
Staff #9
Just an FYI about the BIO blend. Most of the pumps I encounter out my way (Kendall, LaSalle and DeKalb counties, Illinois) are now all designating a BIO blend of 5%-20% on the pump sticker.
 

Crankme69

New Member
Messages
1,901
Likes
7
Location
Illinois the Corruption Capitol of USA
Thread starter #10
Sharing my learning’s...

The SAE 30R7 rated hose is good for diesel service but not recommended for BIO Diesel

The SAE 30R9 is rated for BIO Diesel service and is my preferred choice.

Pricing / purchasing the SAE 30R9 fuel hose was an education to say the least.

The prices ranges were a joke!

The absolute most ridiculous highest cost 30R9 fuel hose came in at $12.00 a foot from your friendly Napa dealer.

The lowest cost 30R9 I found was had for $23 for a 25 foot roll from EP Cleveland Inc, 7621 Hub Parkway, Valley View, Ohio 44125.

No need to tell you what option I selected…I’m tight no secret there lol.

Hope this helps someone down the road & thanks for all the info everyone!

Best Regards,
Greg
 

Burning oil

LeroyDiesel.com
Vendor
Messages
10,269
Likes
1,757
Location
Houston
#11
I think I could do stainless braided teflon lined hose for $12 a foot. I would have to call my hose supplier when I get back.
I told you before, but I like the Good Year hose at Auto Zone with the blue liner. It $3.99 a ft though. I've had it on vehicles for 60K miles running WVO, diesel and some bio D.
 
Messages
5,741
Likes
688
Location
Rural Clifton, Illinois
#13
December 2004
Form No.: 433-0780
Avoid comebacks, install permeation-resistant fuel line hose
Fuel line hoses carry gasoline from the tank to the
fuel pump, to the fuel filter, and to the fuel injection
system. While much of the fuel lines are rigid tube,
sections of it are made of rubber hose, which
absorb engine and road vibrations.
There are two basic types of fuel hose: Fuel and oil
hoses that meet the SAE 30R7 standard, and fuel
injection hose that meets the requirements of SAE
30R9.
Standard fuel and oil (SAE 30R7) hose is rated for
low-pressure applications at 50 psi working
pressure up to 3/8" size, and 35 psi for sizes over
3/8". This general-purpose hose contains a light
reinforcement, and the rubber materials can be any
compound that is suitable for fuel, oil and vapors.
However, Gates Corporation engineers warn
installers that fuel formulations at many US
refineries are constantly changing as proprietary
blends are introduced according to government
mandates and seasonal influences. At times, more
aggressive fuels can extract the oils that give SAE
30R7 hose its flexibility. The result is a brittle, stiff
tube that will greatly reduce the performance and
service life of the hose.
Fuel injection (SAE 30R9) hose or MPI (multi-port
injection) hose is reinforced to handle higher
pressures up to 180 psi. It can be used on all
injection systems that use hose clamps. It is not
designed to replace coupled assemblies on fuel
injection systems.
Fuel injection hose is designed for low permeation
contact with a wide variety of alcohols, alcohol fuel
blends, and diesel fuel. It allows 15g/m2/day
permeation whereas standard SAE 30R7 hose
allows 550g/m2/day. (Gates fuel injection hose
routinely performs at 1 to 2g/m2/day of fuel loss,
well below the allowable standard.)
Gates SAE 30R9 hose uses a laminated tube of
Fluoroelastomer, as a thin wall inner layer backed
by traditional compounds. This first layer protects
the rest of the hose from attack, swelling or
permeation from aromatics, oxidized gasoline (as
can occur in fuel injection systems), ethanol or
oxygenate additives and a wide range of petroleum
based products.
The laminated tube will resist cracking caused by
"sour gas," which forms when unused gas is
returned to the fuel tank. As an added benefit, this
hose construction reduces emissions because fuel
can't evaporate through the hose walls.
SAE30R9 hose is also recommended for diesel
fuel because its fluoroelastomer tube resists
deterioration caused by some diesel fuel additives.
As refineries produce cleaner fuels and lower
allowable permeation rates during the “vehicle at
rest” condition, older hose specifications such as
SAE 30R7 are becoming less reliable. This type of
hose is no longer specified on OEM automotive
fuel applications because of stringent permeation
standards.
Therefore, Gates engineers assert that the best
choice for automotive fuel line hose applications
today is fuel injection SAE30R9 hose. For
installers, it is the best choice for reduced
comebacks and for high performance, assured
trouble free service in a changing fuel environment.
Finally, for submersible applications such as on the
in-tank fuel pump, only SAE30R10 hose should be
used, because when the hose fails, the pump will
fail. Hose construction consists of low swell
fluoroelastomer compounds in the tube and cover
that resist gasoline and diesel fuel permeation and
aging. Standard hoses have these fuel-resistant
characteristics in the tube portion only.
Contact your Gates jobber for information on Gates
MPI/fuel injection hose and submersible fuel line
hose.
Gates Corporation
PO Box 5887, Denver, Colorado 80217
I wonder if anything has changed in the last 14 years
 

Will L.

Well-Known Member
Messages
8,296
Likes
7,688
Location
Boulder City Nv
#14
Yes. The price. The best fuel line to use- still sae30r9

The r10 mentioned for inside fuel tanks resistant to swelling more, but is far less flexible, so not recommend for exterior use.

Also the concearns of gasoline wear fron then has carried over to diesel fuel even more. It is almost impossible to buy Diesel without biofuel in it anywhere in USA because without it the ulsd can not meet lubricity standards. Also more methonal is in both fuels. So if you do buy “straight” ulsd somewhere, ramp up on your lube to the fuel system.

Finally, you’ll notice there is a guy commenting there who wishes he had a nice, well equipped garage in Alaska. Nowadays he has one.
 

Big T

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,623
Likes
1,183
Location
Fullerton, CA
#16
I think I could do stainless braided teflon lined hose for $12 a foot. I would have to call my hose supplier when I get back.
I told you before, but I like the Good Year hose at Auto Zone with the blue liner. It $3.99 a ft though. I've had it on vehicles for 60K miles running WVO, diesel and some bio D.
Leroy, do you sell a stainless braided teflon hose kit for a Feed The Beast set-up? The current set-up was the original rubber hose installation. Would need fittings and hose.
 

Burning oil

LeroyDiesel.com
Vendor
Messages
10,269
Likes
1,757
Location
Houston
#17
Leroy, do you sell a stainless braided teflon hose kit for a Feed The Beast set-up? The current set-up was the original rubber hose installation. Would need fittings and hose.
I looked into it and cost is the problem. So basically no not in Teflon. I do have my regular FTB kit though $49 or with completely brand new FFM already modded for FTB for $199 (while supplies of FFM are available).
 
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