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Not a girdle for a 6.5,

G

great white

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Canada's Ocean Playground
Just daydreaming and thought I'd share:

878beebc-414f-4082-a240-5d921f61ca57web%20pics.jpg


It's for a ford 7.3, but oh wouldn't it be sooo nice if it.......

:rolleyes5:

Ah well. Like I said:

Daydreaming.........;)
 
I keep thinking of a structual pan that would tie into the main caps kinda like a cross bolt. It would save a bunch of room.
 
Ah, I just gotta throw 'em up again:

P400andMountPosition005.jpg


P400PanRemoval003.jpg


P400PanRemoval006.jpg


Mmmmmm, lower end structure reworked, forged crank, reworked block and heads.......I never get tired of looking at those.....:)

Makes me want to throw away any ideas I ever had about an LB7 Swap.....;)

But, as you can see, the pan bolts are not structural and they do not hold the "girdle" to the block. There's separate bolts that hold the bottom end "girdle" to the "pan rail". The pan is held on by significantly smaller bolts.

While it is true that the cast Al pan is more rigid than the stamped steel one on a regular 6.2/5 block, it's not a structural component.

Kinda odd really. When you consider that the target vehicle is military HMMWV's, you would think that a steel pan that could absorb and impact and deflect as opposed to cracking would be a better choice.

;)
 
if the original pan bolts holes are not structural, then the allen head bolts are bolted into which holes? also take the 2 pans, the steel pan and the aluminum pan, turn them on the side and stand on it.. which one flexes more? i would think that the steel pan will give more flex than the aluminum pan would...... so it gives some structural rigidity, after all every little bit helps....
 
Most people worry about mixing metals, but I would not turn down a billet skirt/main cap piece. Who cares how the block expands right, the skirt is there to hold it in place :)
 
turbonator said:
if the original pan bolts holes are not structural, then the allen head bolts are bolted into which holes? also take the 2 pans, the steel pan and the aluminum pan, turn them on the side and stand on it.. which one flexes more? i would think that the steel pan will give more flex than the aluminum pan would...... so it gives some structural rigidity, after all every little bit helps....
Click to expand...

I don't think you're really understanding what you're looking at. The P400 6.5 block is a completely new casting that shares nothing but a very basic configuration and displacement with the original GM 6.5. mainly driven by the ned to replace military HMMWV 6.5's with a more resilient power plant.

The large allen bolts you see go into holes designed for them, not just pain rail holes reamed out larger. The pan bolts to the girdle.

I'm not arguing the pan is not more rigid, I even said that it is.

But the pan is not structural, that's why the "girdle" is there.

;)
 
Turbine Doc said:
There was a guy over on Diesel Page that did I girdle like that for his 6.5, it was a sight to behold, some awesome machine work that he did.
Click to expand...


it was andrew ashwell, his girdle even had the slopping front to accept a stock pan...... he was also one of the first to do a roller rocker valve train, although his set-up involved machining of the heads for mounting and a (i think) 1'' spacer under the valve cover..... he used jesel roller rockers to do his...

we try, on every motor we build for our equipment, to find red block cast rocker assemblies to use..... it is amazing that something made in 1982 could be in as nice as most assemblies that we find..... i think that it makes a difference, maybe not power-wise, but in over-all fit and finish, also the engines seem to run much quieter with them....... imagine if gm bean-counters had not cut the 6.2l project to save money and detroit diesel had stuck in there to add r&d experiance who knows where the motor would have ended up...
 
great white said:
I don't think you're really understanding what you're looking at. The P400 6.5 block is a completely new casting that shares nothing but a very basic configuration and displacement with the original GM 6.5. mainly driven by the ned to replace military HMMWV 6.5's with a more resilient power plant.

The large allen bolts you see go into holes designed for them, not just pain rail holes reamed out larger. The pan bolts to the girdle.

I'm not arguing the pan is not more rigid, I even said that it is.

But the pan is not structural, that's why the "girdle" is there.

;)
Click to expand...

yeah, you are right, i looked closer and they are not in the original pan bolt holes.... i always thought they where.... it makes sense to use bigger and better re-designed holes...... looked at those pics a thousand times too..... anyways for me i think that it will be one helluva long time before i see or lay hands on one of those babies...lol.. maybe when they start to sell on e-bay...
 
turbonator said:
it was andrew ashwell, That's the one, Thanks it's been a while since I participated much over there only so many forum hours in a day imagine if gm bean-counters had not cut the 6.2l project to save money and detroit diesel had stuck in there to add r&d experiance who knows where the motor would have ended up...
Click to expand...

Yes Diesel Depot builds just about all their rebuilds with military 6.2 bottoms on em, the Heath LSR also has a 6.2 lower with 6.5 upper stuff, one theory around the 6.5 block fails is inconsistency when boring blocks on depth of cut per cylinder which may hold some merit when we look at the 6.2 population military surplus, possibly more of those still around due to consistency required to meet mil spec.

I've got an 11-82 "red block" in my garage that was a complete running takeout when it was 1st stored I stumbled on for $250, it's an insurance policy in the waiting.
 
great white said:
Ah, I just gotta throw 'em up again:

P400andMountPosition005.jpg


P400PanRemoval003.jpg


P400PanRemoval006.jpg


Mmmmmm, lower end structure reworked, forged crank, reworked block and heads.......I never get tired of looking at those.....:)

Makes me want to throw away any ideas I ever had about an LB7 Swap.....;)

But, as you can see, the pan bolts are not structural and they do not hold the "girdle" to the block. There's separate bolts that hold the bottom end "girdle" to the "pan rail". The pan is held on by significantly smaller bolts.

While it is true that the cast Al pan is more rigid than the stamped steel one on a regular 6.2/5 block, it's not a structural component.

Kinda odd really. When you consider that the target vehicle is military HMMWV's, you would think that a steel pan that could absorb and impact and deflect as opposed to cracking would be a better choice.

;)
Click to expand...


Pics are dead. That girdle in the first post is like sex, :eek: :thumbsup:
 
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