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Oh, That's why they call em a cumapart...

Discussion in 'All Other Diesels' started by WarWagon, Aug 22, 2015.

  1. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    Oh, That's why they call em a cumapart... And this metallic tapping is going to cost more than a used 6.5 complete engine. Suspecting valve guide or tappet issue. Capped fuel line to #6 and still no change, but, when we tighten down the valve lash on #6 to 0 it goes away.

    Yeah Yeah, just a matter of time... :facepalm:



     
  2. SS FORCE

    SS FORCE Active Member

    200
    77
    Feb 5, 2013
    West Jordan utah
    Just keep driving it till it sounds expensive. Kinda sounds like your already there haha
     
    WarWagon likes this.
  3. Will L.

    Will L. Well-Known Member

    5,257
    2,559
    Jan 25, 2013
    Boulder City Nv
    She doesn't sound happy...
     
    WarWagon likes this.
  4. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    Pulling the head off this week to see WTF. :depressed:
     
  5. Burning oil

    Burning oil LeroyDiesel.com Vendor

    10,040
    1,369
    Jan 3, 2009
    Houston
    I think someone put a card in your spokes.
     
  6. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    So the shop says Cummins engines don't normally use oil. (News to me. Esp with a 6.5 that can use 1 qt every 500 miles...) This one drinks Royal Purple (used it once and never again.) and not as much of other oil. 1 quart every 1-2K miles at least. Suspecting valve guides at this point. Exhaust manifold is done - look at #1 being so close to leaking from warping.

    IMG_4472.jpg
    IMG_4468.jpg
     
  7. 3500GMC

    3500GMC Stand Your Ground

    5,113
    151
    Jun 7, 2009
    Nashport, Ohio
    Somebody's been in there before. I see zip wheel marks on the iron.
     
    WarWagon likes this.
  8. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    Yes, the head was painted gray - not a factory color. Head bolts said to be not hard to take out aka not very tight, exhaust manifold bolts were loose - in fact they re-torqued them and verified it wasn't the issue before pulling the head. Misc stuff not put where it should be for harness hold downs etc.

    Wish the PO would say "why" they were in there before. Rare for a 101K mile Cummins.
     
    jrsavoie likes this.
  9. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    New pic of #6. Not sure if I am seeing the top ring, and if so it doesn't look good.

    IMG-20150901-00805.jpg
     
  10. ak diesel driver

    ak diesel driver Well-Known Member

    11,326
    859
    Feb 7, 2009
    alaska
    maybe it's just the camera angle or the flash but the top of that piston looks way different
     
  11. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    The head is total and complete garbage. My standards may be *low* but, they are not THAT LOW!!!

    Valve guides better than 0.020 loose.
    Soot and oil on backside of most valves.
    Springs bad.
    Moisture pitting on the back sides of the valves.
    And severe debris impact on the #1.

    head.jpg
     
  12. tanman_2006

    tanman_2006 Just a farm kid...

    5,366
    417
    Feb 15, 2010
    Seiling, Oklahoma
  13. ak diesel driver

    ak diesel driver Well-Known Member

    11,326
    859
    Feb 7, 2009
    alaska
    the piston doesn't look like that. did someone put it back together with the head that bad?
     
    SmithvilleD likes this.
  14. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    That's the only thing that makes sense.
     
    SmithvilleD likes this.
  15. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    So one complete used running 6.5 pickup truck cost later... Used head from 5 cylinder 5.9 Cummins with lots of block ventilation, rebuilt the head, new Cummins springs, AFE exhaust manifold, new head bolts...

    The fing noise is Worse!

    You can hear it in the cab at idle and it clatters pretty bad with any fuel. Little bit off the throttle. Will do it without a load now too. Cut #6 injector and noise goes away. Swapped #6 and #3 injector and still the same with cutting out#6.

    Shop took my oil samples and went down to the local lab I used and talked to them. Copper had flashed to 274 with Royal Purple use. 200 is about max for oil cooler washing they said.

    So looking like a possible wrist pin bushing is the best guess at this point.

    FUBAR black hole boat anchor Cummins! The Dodge is about to get a 6.2 ATT Military Surplus Detroit Diesel swap. :rage:

    oil2003dodge.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2015
    tanman_2006 and Burning oil like this.
  16. 3500GMC

    3500GMC Stand Your Ground

    5,113
    151
    Jun 7, 2009
    Nashport, Ohio
    Put a HEMI in it. :woot: :yawn:
     
    WarWagon and tanman_2006 like this.
  17. tanman_2006

    tanman_2006 Just a farm kid...

    5,366
    417
    Feb 15, 2010
    Seiling, Oklahoma
    But the almighty Cummins can never be out matched by the lowly 6.5!
     
    WarWagon likes this.
  18. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    Not sure I am sharing that opinion. This is the 2nd vacation I have been on with the 6.2 powered Patch because the Dodge has been in the shop with a "stump the expert" problem. This one is the 5.9 engine the last being a clutch and missing dowel pin. Parts cost... I could have purchased 2 running 6.5 trucks by now.
     
    tanman_2006 and SS FORCE like this.
  19. WarWagon

    WarWagon Well it hits on 7 of 8...

    7,122
    1,084
    Nov 15, 2009
    AZ
    So the extent that people can go through to fix a Cummins is impressive. I was surprised to learn that this was the original head off this engine. Yeah that means:

    The #1 was sleeved and an aftermarket piston put in. The pushrods were mixed up front to back having the #1 put in the #6. The rings were never loaded enough to seat properly. And nobody bothered to really check the pushrods.

    Nevermind my half blind dad can see this!

    pr1.jpg

    Just in case rolling on a table wasn't a dead giveaway the witness marks, how can you miss that? :facepalm:

    pr2.jpg

    Yet again full power to seat rings. Grandpa driving results in these unseated oil burning rings:

    notseatedrings.jpg

    Looking close you can see the break in coating still on half of both the top and 2nd rings. Hard runs towing I gave it were too late to break them in.
     
  20. Will L.

    Will L. Well-Known Member

    5,257
    2,559
    Jan 25, 2013
    Boulder City Nv
    Yowza, nice pushrod!

    What did you do breaking in? How long did you baby it? And did you 60 degree cross hatch the cylinders? (Pretty sure I remember you having the ball hone from an old thread)
     

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