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Thread: Injector Nozzles

  1. #1
    Registered User 6.2 turbo's Avatar
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    Default Injector Nozzles

    I tested quiet a few used injectors,and nozzles. Pretty much all of them leak. Some the pintles were also stuck. Lapping the needles with polish has debatable results . I used to think a little leak at the tip was ok,since they almost all do this. I have since changed my mind,and think it might be the number one cause of engine failure. Brand new china marine nozzles will also leak. It seems new Bosch nozzles are kinda rare,and Bosch marine nozzles even more rare. I thought that the main difference between the 304 turbo nozzle and the 311 marine nozzle was just the cut off tip. This is not the main difference,the marine nozzle has .010 more travel. Hole sizes are also identical. I believe the extended tip on the turbo nozzles is just there in case of carbon build up,it will not really restrict fuel. The gap between the needle and seat,and also the flat side of the pintle,limit the amount of fuel. For now I'm going to probably use some new stock injectors. Later I want to either increase the travel on 304 nozzles,or get some Monark or Bosio nozzles for Mercedes and VW applications. Does any one know if they would fit ? If not I will just buy one and check it out . I also believe that the reason people have trouble with marine injectors,is probably the nozzles are poor quality,and leak,or the tips carbon up ,because of the shortened needle tip.
    92 Chevy truck modified 6.2 diesel, Has spun bearings 97 Chevy truck solid axle and 5.9 cummins no fuel plate, 370 marine inj,valair twin disc clutch. 96 4 door Tahoe getting a 6.5 diesel swap

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    Registered User 6.2 turbo's Avatar
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    I bought a used Mercedes injector. Very interesting nozzle,it has holes in the needle. The nozzles will only fit in 6.2 long body housings. I pop tested it and it seemed to have more of a finer mist,than a 6.5 nozzle. It also has .040 of travel in the pintle. A stock 304 nozzle has .025 and the 311 marine has .035 travel. Instead of two nozzle options I will now have a lot more. Any VW or Mercedes nozzle will fit.
    92 Chevy truck modified 6.2 diesel, Has spun bearings 97 Chevy truck solid axle and 5.9 cummins no fuel plate, 370 marine inj,valair twin disc clutch. 96 4 door Tahoe getting a 6.5 diesel swap

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    Having been playing with diesel mercedes for about 10 years I know a little about their injectors.

    You should look at the Monark brand injectors for the OM617 motors. Very good stuff. Night and day with my genuine Bosch (germany, not India) ones.

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    Registered User 6.2 turbo's Avatar
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    I think I narrowed it down to a dnosd 265 or 314. I would like to go with Monark. The stock Mercedes nozzle that I have is a dnosd 240. I'm not positive a higher number always means more flow. It does look like the 265 and 314 are flat sided like a 6.5 turbo nozzle.
    92 Chevy truck modified 6.2 diesel, Has spun bearings 97 Chevy truck solid axle and 5.9 cummins no fuel plate, 370 marine inj,valair twin disc clutch. 96 4 door Tahoe getting a 6.5 diesel swap

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    Very interesting.

    Sub'd.

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    Stand Your Ground 3500GMC's Avatar
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    Yep short inj, short nozzle, long, long...

    Interesting and thought provoking..

    I think the reason I have to crank timing is because I'm trying to push too much fuel through the std Bosch 6.2 long nozzles...It's like the spray duration is too long. I need to fix this...
    '93 GMC Sierra SLE K3500 RCLB 4L80E 4.10 axles, lockers, JB8 13x3.5 brakes, 4X4 SRW 1TON, 6.5TD now a fully ported big valve '82 6.2 turbocharged, mandrel straight pipe w/ warpspeed x-over, Fluidampr, tweeked DB2-2831-4911 IP, Battery relocation, H/O W/P, CDR elim custom vent, PYO wheels w/285-75 Dick Cepek FC-II's - Quasar Blue and Argent Silver two tone.

    ...and other various GM cars and trucks


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    Registered User turbonator's Avatar
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    Another good thread, will be keeping an eye on it for sure..... great info you guys...
    rattle-puss: 1992 gmc 3500 2wd,reg cab, dually, 6.2/6.5l 4l80e...currently testing some compound turbo and fuel delivery combinations, custom front cross-over turbo manifolds, fire-ringed, 5 pin stiffy , penn. upper, custom sealed ram airbox, 18" donaldson filter, 1982 style primary filter, general fuel filter before carter 4094 lift pump, intercooler, water mist injection set @ 12&15 psi, relocated hayden tranny cooler(under bed) 2nd spin-on tranny filter, prosport EGT, tranny temp, tach, equiss boost, faze engine oil temp, DCR back pressure,diff temp gauge, air horn, OEM console....... there are 2 of us... jim types with proper capitals, jeff types without caps.

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    Just Another Diesel Guy Turbine Doc's Avatar
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    IIRC Kennedy's h/o nozzles used Mercedes tips on GM injector bodies I don't know which tips he used I need to go out to my shop & see if I still have a set out there with those tips on em.
    Tim (A-ACLU #29)
    98 (S)K1500,3.73 gear,4L80,Heath 4"exh,Amsoil air & bypass oil flts,Heath fan clutch,Stans Xover,pilar mtd BST/EGT/TRN,remote 12v fan tran cool,PML trans pan, PML diff cover, Hi pops, Heath PCM,Heath remote FSD, HDP Balance Flow, Heath lift pump, SSBC front calipers, EGR rear disc conversion, Goodrich brake lines, No-Slip locker, Roadmaster suspension, Lube specialist oil lines, Putnam lock & load hitch, A-team turbo.

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    Registered User turbonator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbine Doc View Post
    IIRC Kennedy's h/o nozzles used Mercedes tips on GM injector bodies I don't know which tips he used I need to go out to my shop & see if I still have a set out there with those tips on em.
    Well, once again, we see that we are not inventing the wheel, just seeing how it turns....LOL. Would be interesting to see what were used in the H/O nozzles.
    rattle-puss: 1992 gmc 3500 2wd,reg cab, dually, 6.2/6.5l 4l80e...currently testing some compound turbo and fuel delivery combinations, custom front cross-over turbo manifolds, fire-ringed, 5 pin stiffy , penn. upper, custom sealed ram airbox, 18" donaldson filter, 1982 style primary filter, general fuel filter before carter 4094 lift pump, intercooler, water mist injection set @ 12&15 psi, relocated hayden tranny cooler(under bed) 2nd spin-on tranny filter, prosport EGT, tranny temp, tach, equiss boost, faze engine oil temp, DCR back pressure,diff temp gauge, air horn, OEM console....... there are 2 of us... jim types with proper capitals, jeff types without caps.

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    LeroyDiesel.com Burning oil's Avatar
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    Very interesting, looking forward to more info.
    Leroy.
    www.leroydiesel.com <<< CLICK
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbine Doc View Post
    IIRC Kennedy's h/o nozzles used Mercedes tips on GM injector bodies I don't know which tips he used I need to go out to my shop & see if I still have a set out there with those tips on em.
    Waiting........



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    I ordered a dnosd 261 Monarch from Mercedessource. It was the only one they sell individually. I got a set of 8 long body 6.2 injectors,and 2 more Mercedes injectors ,at the junk yard. The 6.2 injectors are USA Bosch,the nozzles are dnosd 248. They also have a long travel of .040. I know from experience that these nozzles don't make any power with a turbo .
    92 Chevy truck modified 6.2 diesel, Has spun bearings 97 Chevy truck solid axle and 5.9 cummins no fuel plate, 370 marine inj,valair twin disc clutch. 96 4 door Tahoe getting a 6.5 diesel swap

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    Gotta follow this.

    A bit of my own scratching around revealed a mercedes nozzel does fit the standard 6.5 body with a bit of lathe time, and it seems to have potential, but also doesn't move as much fuel as the 6.5 nozzel.

    Where are y'all setting your pop pressures?
    1994 K1500 3.8 - vm638. hx30/hx52 4l80e
    1992 K1500 3.9 - Fuel and air mods.

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    I was going to go with 2500 psi. But I might go lower to get full pintle travel ? The 304 nozzle would probably be the best one for high pop pressure,since it has very little travel. The dnosd 240 Mercedes needle has a .005 hole in the tip,and .010 hole across the tip. It is supposed to create a pilot injection. I seriously thought about trying a used set of these. I already have 3,and know were to find more.
    92 Chevy truck modified 6.2 diesel, Has spun bearings 97 Chevy truck solid axle and 5.9 cummins no fuel plate, 370 marine inj,valair twin disc clutch. 96 4 door Tahoe getting a 6.5 diesel swap

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    Seems to me, proportionally OM617 nozzles are to small for a 6.5. An 8 cyl version of a OM617 would be 4.8 liters. The spray patten may not be optimum for the 6.5's chambers also.

    Will a smaller nozzle cause a higher peak back pressure on the pump? Increase the time it will take to get the whole fuel dose in at wot? Limit the max rpm or power?
    Around these parts a "high end" paint job means you sprung for the brand name rattle cans.

    81 Olds Cutlass 350 Diesel (runs needs some TLC)
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    96 Surburban 2500 4wd 6.5l TD, barn doors, man transfer case, 8600# suspension, full floater 14 bolt, (waiting for new heads)

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